EFI Herald

[Clive]

Roger, a quick thought. If you use the RR pump, have you thought how to attach it? It looks like the tank will need some studs attaching, Possibly a ring with threaded holes and studs going out either side, gasket under ring and nuts in the tank to pull it down, then gasket on top for the pump. Just an idea!

Not sure if you can create a round swirlpot/baffle around the pump, ideally with the fuel return feeding into it. A bit of exhaust tube would work, with some holes in it. or similar. Have heard of a diesel filter housing being used in the tank. Infact, if you used my patented ringidea from above, you could make a larger hole in the top of the tank with concentic rings of studs, each welded to the ring to fix.

[rogerguzzi]

Hello Clive

                 I was thinking of a ring with treaded holes maybe on on a tube slightley above the tank(Depends on measurements) then just the tube to weld/braze in?

 

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

roger

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

             I have ordered the nos Range Rover pump(best offer accepted) they are supposed to be good for 100,000 miles so will see me out?

 

I have been thinking of the fuel starvation issue as the pump will be mounted in the left hand side of the tank so there should only be a problem with low fuel and Fast left handers (right handers should flood the pump)

 

I have welded an adaptor collar on the exhaust pipe today for the lambda sensor and done a few mods on the centre section(too long and different diameter to new front pipe)

 

So it is ready to fit properly now.

 

Still waiting for the vacuum adaptors before drilling the manifolds( from China)

 

Is 8mm copper pipe ok for the fuel feed or should I use kunifer pipe?

 

I have been looking at fuel filters and can not make up my mind whether to get get one with tails or threaded like these

 

 http://www.eurocarparts.com/fuel-filters

 

http://www.eurocarparts.com/fuel-filters

 

I have still to workout how to open the throttles! I think I will order a couple of 5mm throttle ball joints (I could modify the Triumph one but add the ball joints)

 

Roger

[John Bonnett]

Matter of the moment for me now Roger. I'm going BMW K1100 power for the G15. I have been looking at Rally Design for both pump and filter.

 

http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=21806

 

http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=24012

 

I'd be interested to hear what you think about them.

 

I shall be using 8mm copper tube for both feed and return. I'll also be incorporating a swirl pot probably on the tank outlet in the form of a little box that will always be full of fuel. Pipes blowing off under pressure is a concern so a bit of thought needed for the unions on the pressure side. I shall be fitting an inertia switch to cut the pump off in the event of a crash. 

[rogerguzzi]

Hello John

                 I am sure that pump and filter would be ok but you will have to fit a pre filter as well I think?

 

There are cheaper filters about and unless its on show I can not see the need for that type(other than you can clean it) but our tanks are going the be spotlessly clean when installed so the throw away ones will last for years.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Injection-Fuel-Filter-Austin-Maestro-XC-Hatchback-2-0-EFI-/331969591931?hash=item4d4aedfa7b:g:aikAAOSw8w1X2DcG

 

I am going for a pump in the tank as they are supposed to be quieter? and cooled by the fuel(I think most moderns are done this way)and the pre filter is built in(its only to stop large lumps that would jam the pump)

 

I have been working on making a loom today for the injectors(slow going if you want it to look tidy ish)

 

I hope this does not all end in tears(and not just frustration)

 

I have used the new milling machine a few times now(how did I manage before) I have even gone mad and fitted Digital Read Out(cheap from China and only £20 import duties)

 

So now I will be able make c******ups the the nearest 0.0005" !!!!!

 

Does the BMW engine lie flat on its side not at an angle like the Imp one?(and a lot more BHP I would think?)

 

Roger

[Clive]

John, there is a cossie 12mm pre filter, it needs to be big bore as the pumps are hopeless at sucking! But none are cheap.

As to pump, I have a pump here that may well be suitable, but checking. Not a repro, came with a pukka, brand new Deutz engine. Meant for diesel, but I am pretty certain they are OK with either fuel. 12mm inlet, 8mm outlet.Part no.04127127, but not a lot of info out there....However, used on commercial engines, and last forever....

[John Bonnett]

I'm sure all will be fine Roger but I can relate to a bit of tension just before putting volts on a freshly made and connected circuit particularly where there is an ecu involved.

 

I've got to make a tank but it won't be deep enough to house a pump so I have to have an external one.

 

I'm glad you are putting the milling machine to good use. A tremendous asset to the workshop.

 

The bike engine lies horizontal and mates to the Imp transaxle using a bespoke flywheel and cnc machined billet aluminium bell housing. An integral cush drive prevents any sudden shock loading through the transmission which is really good news.  Power wise at 100bhp it is little more than a full house 998 engine but it should win hands down on cost and reliability. The great thing is that the engine has loads of low down torque and maximum power is at seven five which is much the same as an Imp and very different from a Sports bike. 

 

John

[rogerguzzi]

Hello John

                 How about one like this?

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MAZDA-DEMIO-1-3-PETROL-FUEL-PUMP-SENDER-SENDING-UNIT-IN-TANK-1996-2002-/262732294271?hash=item3d2c10a87f:g:nJMAAOSwA3dYNmoP

 

looks short and fixing holes and flow and return pipes.

 

Roger

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

             What about using this tube or that OTT?

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8mm-pvc-coated-copper-microbore-plumbing-pipe-tube-diy-gas-oil-caravan-new-/161158858428?var=460235669398&hash=item2585d106bc:m:m82P8I6QlcEboLLuFgNz6tA

 

or just go with

 

http://www.screwfix.com/search?search=8mm+copper+tube

 

Roger

 

ps I think I used some kunifer to replace the existing fuel pipe a few years ago

[John Bonnett]

John, there is a cossie 12mm pre filter, it needs to be big bore as the pumps are hopeless at sucking! But none are cheap.

As to pump, I have a pump here that may well be suitable, but checking. Not a repro, came with a pukka, brand new Deutz engine. Meant for diesel, but I am pretty certain they are OK with either fuel. 12mm inlet, 8mm outlet.Part no.04127127, but not a lot of info out there....However, used on commercial engines, and last forever....

Thank you Clive for your kind thought. The pump sounds a bit heavy duty for my application so I'll probably go for something a bit smaller. I had good results with an Astra GTE pump and filter on the Cosworth YB but they are probably a bit thin on the ground now. The Rally Design pump at nineteen pounds seems very good value so I may go for that.

[Clive]

No worries. It doesn't look any bigger than other external pumps I have seen, 

Happy to measure/weigh if needed.

 

Another thought, have you considered the CAV fuel filter, may help and act as a bit of a swirl pot too? But a bit heavier than a disposable filter.

[Darren Groves]

Managed a sneaky hour in the garage this evening, exhaust manifold back on and 02 sensor in, angle and positioning worked well as it's all quite tight down there.

 

 

Inlet manifold bolted on and Throttle Body attached. I hadn't done any trial fits, just took measurements so there was a really good chance I'd done something stupid. The good news is that the Throttle Body is exactly where I wanted it to be and there's clearance between it and the bonnet when it's closed. There's also a nice sized gap between the other end of the plenum and the bulkhead and the wheel arch.

 

 

I can now start running the wires to injectors, air & water temp sensors, TPS and IAC valve.

[John Bonnett]

No worries. It doesn't look any bigger than other external pumps I have seen, 

Happy to measure/weigh if needed.

 

Another thought, have you considered the CAV fuel filter, may help and act as a bit of a swirl pot too? But a bit heavier than a disposable filter.

 

Yes please Clive. That would be very kind if you could measure it. Any chance of a photo?

[Clive]

You have incoming mail.

[John Bonnett]

You have incoming mail.

Thank you Clive. Perhaps I could give you a call.

[rogerguzzi]

Managed a sneaky hour in the garage this evening, exhaust manifold back on and 02 sensor in, angle and positioning worked well as it's all quite tight down there.

 

WP_20161211_003.jpg

 

Inlet manifold bolted on and Throttle Body attached. I hadn't done any trial fits, just took measurements so there was a really good chance I'd done something stupid. The good news is that the Throttle Body is exactly where I wanted it to be and there's clearance between it and the bonnet when it's closed. There's also a nice sized gap between the other end of the plenum and the bulkhead and the wheel arch.

 

WP_20161211_001.jpg

 

I can now start running the wires to injectors, air & water temp sensors, TPS and IAC valve.

Hello Darren

                    Have you mounted the Lambda sensor upright?(it looks like that in the photo) this site seem to advise against that!

 

http://wbo2.com/lsu/position.htm

 

I have mounted mine at an angle of about 30/40degs from vertical(no choice really)

 

I have done some more of the wiring.

 

I have made the injectors and TPS into one loom and all connected(and TPS still works)

 

I have also wired the pump circuit as far as the output fuse ( safety cutout switch and manual on/off switch)

 

I thought I had a problem with the pump circuit as I seemed to be getting no power to the fuse! but on checking a spade end had broken off and I had not read the instructions properly!

 

You only get power to the pump for 2 seconds if the there is no crank rotation(which I do)

 

I went with the tail type filter can(Austin Maestro 2lt type) it is a bit bigger than I thought but will probably never need changing.

 

I was thinking when I have modified the fuel tank whether to coat the inside with one of the special paints as there is slight rusting on the bottom seams.

 

Roger

[Darren Groves]

Hi Roger,

 

I haven't seen that link before, only that it should be installed between 10-2 o'clock. The choice of angle was limited given the position, as it had to fit between gearbox and chassis rail. It's difficult to tell from the image, but mine certainly isn't upright.

 

Darren

[rogerguzzi]

Hello Learned EFI People

                                          A bit more progress of sorts(had to leave messing with exhaust pulled back! and no it was carrying logs into the house)

 

So I have been looking at making an air box(can't spell Plenum? ) this is the result so far and yes I know it will need bigger holes for the throttle bodies to breath through(40mm hole saw on order)

 

It measures 100mm tall x 65mm deep now is it worth fitting some of these inside? (its only a road car) perhaps the 25mm ones

 

http://www.ebay.co.u...=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

 

I am thinking 2 flexible pipes fitted to the front and running outside the engine shields to under the bumper area 38mm would fit well but possibly 45mm at a push!

 

So would 38mm be big enough? (1 !/2" dia) and a K&N on the end unless I can fit one inside?

 

Roger

 

I may have to modify the front end of the airbox as it just catches the bonnet gas strut!!!!!

 

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

              My Range Rover fuel pump arrived today and I think it is going to fit quite well, 

 

I just need to make a flange about 12mm to 15mm thick and not drill the holes right through then just weld or braze it to the top of the tank

 

It was made by AC and has non return vales built in! so should be ok!

 

The last photo shows a 75mm disc on the tank it has got to be 80mm

 

. I Was thinking of making something similar to these: http://www.mgaroadst...Stub_Stacks.htm

 

Found this on fleabay so less machining!

 

http://www.ebay.co.u...=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

 

What do you all think?

 

Roger

 

 

 

             

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

              A bit more progress today I thought I would have a go at fitting the fuel pump into the tank.

 

I am pleased with the result the filter sits about 5 to 10mm off the base.(about the same as the original dip pipe)

 

The flange just want's drilling and tapping and welding or brazing into the tank. (the tube goes into tank about 25mm screws are outside so less chance of leaking

 

Roger

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

             Not to much progress in the last couple of days(Christmas stuff gets in the way?)

 

I have made a heat shield that bolts onto long studs that project out the rear of the throttle body flange mountings(could not resist cleaning the faces up on my NEW milling machine! so that's about  £300 a job up to now?)

 

I have decided to TRY and fit a baffle plate into the fuel tank about 3" high and via the top of the tank! 

 

I have made a baffle and the plan is to feed it in via the pump mounting hole with a slot(see photo) then drill tank and fix into place with screws which will be brazed over.

 

The original feed pipe is angled towards the pump so I will try and adjust it so the discharges over the top of the baffle plate

 

Then fit a larger plate for the pump mounting welded and or brazed in place.

 

I think then I will use one of the tank sealants which should seal the bottom edge(I like the look of Slosh?)

 

I can see this being very frustrating but if I can do it with out cutting a hole in the side would be good.

 

I have been thinking about the air temperature sensor mounting? do I fit it into the air box so the ECU knows the temperature at this point or say in front of the radiator and shielded from the air flow to measure general air temperature(I suppose moderns have 2?)

 

Roger

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

             I have managed to fit the baffle(temporary) with a bit of fiddling and cursing it is 3" high and 8" from end of the tank.(the rod in the photo is to place it in position) I have to work out how to get the nut off?

 

I was thinking of drilling some holes about 10/12 mm up from the bottom as the sides and bottom should seal quite well

 

I have located it with 2 pop rivets for now, I was thinking perhaps drill another hole above or below the pop rivet just in the tank and plug weld or braze through it?

 

Also use steel pop rivets and braze over them.

 

Roger

 

[Darren Groves]

Have had a couple of sessions on the Herald in the last week, so have made some decent progress.

 

First was to get the fuel rail drilled for the injectors, this was done by me and a friend who is a retired engineer, fiddly job but turned out well. I then had to get the ends squared off and tapped to take the -6 adapter. I was a bit worried about clearance between fuel rail and heater valve, but it just fits thankfully.

 

All the under dash wiring was done a few months ago, poked through the bulkhead and left coiled up. So it was time to finish this off and fit the connectors for the injectors, IAT Sensor, CLT Sensor, TPS, and IAC Valve.

 

Also shortened the accelerator cable to work on the Rover Throttle Body. Need a couple of penny washers to secure the cable better and a more appropriate solderless nipple, but it all works fine.

 

Also removed the original 6mm fuel line and replaced with 8mm, this will be the return back to the tank.

 

  

 

Getting quite close.....

 

 

 

 

[Darren Groves]

Another productive couple of sessions, the to do list is getting shorter.

 

Yesterday I fabricated a bracket to secure the fuel rail so it doesn't shoot off when under pressure, needs a slight modification as it seems to be holding the injectors a little too high.

 

I'm using steel braided PTFE fuel line to/from the fuel rail, I hadn't thought it through on how I was going to connect them to the regulator and filter, so yesterday I ordered a few more fittings and at 10am this morning they arrived, this meant I could connect up the last of the fuel lines. I also decided on how to connect the water hoses from the thermostat housing to heater.

 

I am just waiting on a few hose connectors before I can test to see if the fuel lines can hold the required pressure, once I'm happy this is the case I can then think about getting it to the point of trying to start it. Before that I need to set-up a few bits.

 

The Coolant & Air Temp sensors are ones that are listed in the ECU, so it's just a matter of selecting them from a drop down list. The Throttle Position Sensor will need calibrating, but that's simple, no idea how to set up the IAC valve, but that'll only be needed for warm-up.

 

I bit the bullet and upgraded from the free to registered version of the Tuning software, I hate paying for software, but importantly it has it's own auto-tune function. Literally you just need to drive the car and it will learn where to make adjustments to fuel etc. so I suspect it will be worth every penny of the £50.00.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rogerguzzi]

Hello Darren

                    You are making good progress.

 

I seem to be getting bogged down with little things?

 

I have fitted the baffle into the tank and fixed it with 2 x 4BA steel nuts and screws and I driiled 4off 4mm holes in it about 12mm from bottom of tank plus the one that had the holding rod in it.(I did a test on a plastic 5lt container with side cut off) and it took 45secs to let out 1lt.

 

I am just waiting for some brazing rods and flux and I will weld and braze it.(and fingers crossed test for leaks)

 

I have adjusted the return pipe to discharge towards the baffle.

 

I have made a heat shield to go under the throttle bodies.

 

Roger