david lewis Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 hi all from new member. my heater only blows cold on my recently purchased 1969 13/60 even with the control pulled out so I think the valve ( Delaney ? ) or the matrix is blocked. can I remove the front of the heater to get at the matrix without having to remove the whole thing ? or have any of you experts got any ideas of how to fix it. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 I experienced the same problem on my own 13/60 but mine has the Smith's heater. However, having replaced the valve, flushed the matrix thoroughly (twice) and replaced all the hoses, the heater still blew out cold air . I eventually worked out that the pipe that flows through the inlet manifold was blocked. I cleared it out with a curtain wire and the heater now works, but is fairly useless in a draughty convertible . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 You can with a fiddle get the matrix out from a smiths, I have no idea about the Delaney, garden hose on the tubes shifts some crud but will flow well with only a couple of tubes cleared, doesnt mean the many others are flowing. valves can clog up like Eddie's tubes check you have a std. 82c thermostat and its working. cold climates went to 88c but thats too hot for normal english climate and is more common on younger leaner cars of the 70-80s Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve C Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 Hi David I rebuilt my Herald 1200 heater this year, so this may help: As Pete says, check the stat is working and the right one for the car. The traditional method is to dangle it on some wire into a Pyrex jug or dish of water straight out of the Kettle, and if it does not open, it is stuffed. Cheap enough to replace from Canley, Rimmers et.al. I think it is probably a Smith's heater in your car as original equipment, and it should say so on the front plate. If not it may have been swapped, but I thought Delaney units tended to be found in earlier cars (Pete will correct me if I am wrong!) The valves can get full of solidified crud, in which case both Smiths and Delaney are available from Rimmers, but the latter are pricey. Don't forget to order the O ring seal as well. Matrixes can be flushed as Pete says, but it pays to remember they are all now getting pretty old. I bought a new one from this guy, and his service is excellent: http://www.demisterman.co.uk/ If you do fit one of his, the centres on the inlet and outlet pipes on the repro item are about a centimetre further apart, and you may have to enlarge the holes in the front plate with a small grindstone on a drill to get the plate to slot over cleanly. Don't force it, the matrix is delicate! Demisterman supplies self-adhesive foam strip for sealing the matrix correctly into the box, and the principle here is that you are trying to avoid giving your newly-heated air anywhere to leak out other than where you want it to go. It is not necessary to remove the heater box to do any of the above, and if you do, the gasket sealing it to the flap box inside the car is NLA, so you will be making one or using silicone sealant. Thus rejuvenated, your heater should be surprisingly powerful, if not up to Volvo standards. Mine is in a convertible and it is surprisingly toasty around the toes even with the lid down on a cold day. They can be uprated further by fitting Nissan Micra or early VW Golf fans and motors (see various t'interweb threads) but you are then into modifying the box, and the wiring for multi-choice switch gear, and losing originality. Good luck! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 Delaney units tended to be found in earlier cars Both units fitted at random throughout production, but not to Vitesses as there isn't room for a Delaney Galley C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Groves Posted December 11, 2014 Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 Further to Steve's post I also used the Demisteman and can confirm service and product were both very good. I shouldn't bother with changing the fan to the VW Golf one as it actually spins in the wrong direction, so it's pushing air the wrong way. I currently have one I my Herald, no improvement to airflow inside the car even at top speed. I keep meaning to check out a Micra fan, but haven't got round to it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lewis Posted December 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2014 wow great response, thanks guys for your advice. I will have a poke around this weekend and see if I can find a blockage. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sulzerman Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 Hello David if your matrix is not leaking, but blocked I unblocked mine with radiator central heating descaler. I removed the matrix and filled it with descaler and left it to stand for a couple days. It worked well after this treatment. Hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lewis Posted December 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2014 hi all, had a poke around yesterday but will have to investigate further and try to back flush the system. the heater seems to be a Delaney so the demistermans matrix is different,has anyone any experience in removing the Delaney matrix just by removing the front cover rather than the whole heater system ? . I will try the descaler too. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted December 15, 2014 Report Share Posted December 15, 2014 From memory it is only 2 bolts under the dash that hold it all in. Unless my memory is worse than I thought.... You will need to remove hoses etc whatever you do, and getting it out of the car will make life so much easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishmosh Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 doddle to remove. My Delaney in the Herald is excellent. However the Smiths in the Bond is pretty grim. The Motor is noisy ( But only when in the unit...) but the main problem is that when the PO repaired the chamber , he didnt make a good job of it so the heater doesnt seal well against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lewis Posted January 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2015 hi guys , further to my heater post the situation is that all heater hoses get hot so the valve is ok but the hose at the top of the Delaney heater does not get hot. I have looosened the hose right off and after some bubbles get a strong water flow. my problem is that I want to know is the top heater hose the return or entry for the water as I want to reverse flush the matrix. can anyone help? cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted January 5, 2015 Report Share Posted January 5, 2015 Don't know about a Delaney but on a Smith's the top hose from the heater is the return/outlet. If you disconnect it from the heater altogether you should see which way the water is flowing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 Just flush it both ways several times.....usually loads of silt comes out, but that is not always enough to revive a heater. A good friend had to take his heater valve out to get his heater to work, even though he swapped valves and both seemed to work ok off the car. Really odd.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pageste Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 Hi David, hope you dont mind me butting in to your post My 1969 13/60 came with a Delaney heater. As expected the valve eventualy started leaking and was beyond help. Ive gone mad and spent the kids pocket money on a replacement but I see it comes with a colied tube (capillary) which my old one didnt have. Can anyone tell me what it does / where it goes ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted March 17, 2015 Report Share Posted March 17, 2015 Inside the car to controll the valve it maintains cabine temperature steady with varying water temperature poke it in the footwell near the air outlet pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pageste Posted March 18, 2015 Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 Cheers Pete,finally got the body on after a fashion so bolting on the ancillaries.such fun ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted March 18, 2015 Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 Incidentally you can’t dismantle a Delaney on the car as the front cover is screwed right the way round with small self-tappers; you can’t get at the bottom ones while it’s still fitted. Smiths' covers with the large clips may be able to be removed; I’ve never tried it on the car. The Delaney matrix is larger than the Smiths so theoretically should put out more heat; the fan is also a different design. I’m in the middle of rebuilding one and the quantity of dead leaves, twigs and other debris that was inside the box was amazing, so removing that, if nothing else, should aid air flow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Hello, New to all this found madness - i've just flushed my vitesse heater matrix and loads of crud came out. My question is when I put the heater valve back it only seems to 'push' back onto the heater hose inlet (on the heater matrix) is this normal of should there be some sort of clamp? Also there was no temperature thermostat in the housing on the engine, should I get another or is this a normal 'modification'? Great posts and help, many thanks for helping a newbie classic car owner ;-) P.S sorry the car is a vitesse mk1 with smiths heater. Kind regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted March 31, 2015 Report Share Posted March 31, 2015 Also there was no temperature thermostat in the housing on the engine, should I get another or is this a normal 'modification'? There definitely should be a thermostat. Removing it is often a "modification" that is carried out to disguise an overheating problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted April 1, 2015 Report Share Posted April 1, 2015 the heater valve back it only seems to 'push' back onto the heater hose inlet (on the heater matrix) It's a bit of a dodgy arrangement. It does push on and should have a rubber doughnut 'gasket' (P/N A147) between the valve and the inlet. The valve is held to the inlet by a stepped clamp screwed to the heater box. Edit - Brainfade (now got a D-G) see Steve's post below. C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted April 1, 2015 Report Share Posted April 1, 2015 Right then, off to buy a thermostart many thanks Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve C Posted April 1, 2015 Report Share Posted April 1, 2015 The valve seats on to a small mounting plate with two threaded studs which is riveted to the front plate of the heater. You can just see it on this drawing: http://www.canleyclassics.com/triumph-herald-1200-heater-details A small o-ring type seal (Rimmer Brothers list it as C9928A) seats in a recess in the rear of the valve (seen on the left in the link below) and as the valve tightens down on its mounting plate, this is compressed to form a seal around the matrix pipe. http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/ImagePopUp.aspx?i=GRID005209 See previous thread on this forum about heaters - if the matrix is ancient, flushing it may not help that much! Regards Steve C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted April 2, 2015 Report Share Posted April 2, 2015 Many thanks,thermostat to fit tomorrow then I'm going to give it start and see where it leaks Kind regards Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 3, 2015 Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 make sure you have a stst with a jiggle pin bleed hole in the support rim or you wont expell any air while its shut many sold without, you need an 82c if the holes missing drill a 3mm hole in the support rim. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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