** ON TO THE NEXT BIT ** Nose to Tail - 1972 Spitfire MkIV restoration upgrades!!

[Badwolf]

Thank you both. Any other ideas will be greatly received.

I like Peter's dual cutter idea. Wider one to cut down about 3/16th inch using a drill and stand for control then then slightly smaller one straight through. Then using my old school marking guage set the depth and use the marking needle to cut sideways. The plywood should separate fairly easily or at least enough to finish off with a scalpel. I have found the original plastic dash in the spares box which will be ideal to get sizes etc. as I didn't want to start taking guages out to measure.

[Badwolf]

One thing that I've noticed is that some dashboards have their fag lighters at a lower position than the hole in the metal work, as shown on the parts diagram posted earlier. Does anyone have any experience of this. This picture of this LHD spit gives the layout with the clock in the 'approved' place but the metal plate would have to be drilled out to put the lighter there. I'm not sure that it looks 'right'. While I am putting the clock in I want to put the lighter socket either in a decent position on the dash or even out of sight inside the glove box.

This picture below is what I was originally going to do...

I had no idea that there were so many layouts. Anyone else have a similar arrangement?

[Mjit]

Based on John Thomason's "Guide to Originality" book the lower position is the only 'correct' one for the cigar lighter.  'Early switchgear' cars didn't have one at all and 'TR7 switchgear' had one in that lower position.

As for the clock there should already be a hole in the metal panel in that position - it's where the GT6 has one of its eyeball vents and they used the same pressing for both cars.

[Badwolf]

Thanks Mjit

7 hours ago, Mjit said:

Based on John Thomason's "Guide to Originality" book the lower position is the only 'correct' one for the cigar lighter.  'Early switchgear' cars didn't have one at all and 'TR7 switchgear' had one in that lower position.

As for the clock there should already be a hole in the metal panel in that position - it's where the GT6 has one of its eyeball vents and they used the same pressing for both cars.

Now that I have a clock on it's way, the time has come to start taking it all apart again!!!

...and this is the metal support behind my wooden dashboard.  The dashboard was originally the plastic variety, but this wooden one came my way on a visit to a breakers, in the days when you could have a good look around. Anyway, as you can see there is a circular hole (for the record it's 62mm in diameter) and another which is not a true oval, more a rounded off rectangle (which is 35mm wide, 44mm overall length with a section 20mm long where the sides are roughly parallel before the curve starts). I don't know why it is such an interesting shape? I had assumed that the circle was for a clock and the 'oval' for a cigar lighter. As you can see, there is no provision in the metalwork for the cigar lighter at the bottom, just a hole for the locating bolts. Looks like I have a very strange layout, but that doesn't surprise me, hence my original plan to follow that in the second photo above.

[Josef]

Well, that indirectly tells us that a Dolly has a different air vent to a GT6 Mk3…

[Badwolf]

4 hours ago, Josef said:

Well, that indirectly tells us that a Dolly has a different air vent to a GT6 Mk3…

That's true, but although the air vent was bigger than expected I am very grateful that you took the time and trouble to find it and measure it for me.

[Josef]

11 hours ago, Badwolf said:

That's true, but although the air vent was bigger than expected I am very grateful that you took the time and trouble to find it and measure it for me.

Any time  Though I’m mostly glad (from the sound of it?) you don’t have an oversize clock coming!

[Mjit]

19 hours ago, Badwolf said:

As you can see, there is no provision in the metalwork for the cigar lighter at the bottom, just a hole for the locating bolts.

The very bottom right hold looks to be about the right location and from memory isn't a mounting hole (that's just the far top left one and the one in the rectangular recess).  It's too small but that could just be down to the age of your car and Triumph just enlarged it on the pressing when they started using it for the cigar lighter mount?  Need a 'naked' late 1500 photo for comparison.

[Mjit]

19 hours ago, Josef said:

Well, that indirectly tells us that a Dolly has a different air vent to a GT6 Mk3…

I can tell you GT6 ones are the same size an Mk2 2000 ones.  I say that as the owners of a 2000 parts car and a Mk IV Spitfire that now has eyeball vents in the dash

[Badwolf]

What would that strangely shaped, rectangular(ish) hole have been for? 

Does anyone else with a Spitfire have a cigar lighter fitting and if so, where is it?  Yes, it probably has a USB converter power socket in it, which is why I want to fit one.  The radio has one USB, but add two mobile phones and a satnav and I need the extra.

[Mjit]

OK, so working on the theory "Triumph didn't like to invest any money" I took a look at some 'roundtail' cockpit photos and:

1. The roundtail Spitfires have a grab handle on the p/s, secured to the  dash facia by 3 bolts - which probably explains the near left/almost in the clock hole/bottom right holes.
2. The roundtail GT6 Mk1 had it's two speed wiper switch on more or less the same position as the 'odd hole' - which while a dainty toggle on the cabin side Canley's show as being a chunky rectangular box behind the dash.

If I had to guess I'd say Triumph just kept the same pressing, adding extra holes over the life of the car but not removing them so they could still just have a single part to stock in the spares store (and keep using the same old press tool rather than splashing out on a new one).  Maybe that early GT6 wiper switch mounted to the dash facia rather than metal panel so needed a hole big enough to pass through (and rounded corners are 'better' than square ones from the engineering PoV).

[Josef]

From the shape of the dash pressing I don’t think any of it has been recycled from the roundtails. Mine has a smooth slightly curved profile from the LH edge to where it curves down to meet the dash support. BW’s later one dips down near the leftmost hole and then continues straight ish. 
 

I’ll put away my anorak now…

[Badwolf]

Just flicking through my Courier 506, over coffee this afternoon and what to I spy on page 60, the side by side layout of dial and lighter. Admittedly a GT6 but interesting.

[Mjit]

Ah, but you'd have to ask Mr Cook if that was put there by the factory or a dealer/owner.

Actually (yes work is slow today, why do you ask?) the cigar lighter's there in the "fitted to my GT6...shortly after I bought the car" but doesn't seem to be there in the "Mountney wood rimmed" photo below it (though it could be litterally JUST out of shot).

 

 

<pedant>And that's the GT6 eyeball vent, not a dial</pedant>

[Badwolf]

Of course it's a vent not a dial. Just difficult to make out if you don't know what it is. I should have realised having referenced the vents earlier in the thread. Thanks.

[Peter Truman]

Josef what is hiding behind what appears to be a closed in passenger parcel shelf? You don't have to answer if too revealing

[Josef]

7 hours ago, Peter Truman said:

Josef what is hiding behind what appears to be a closed in passenger parcel shelf? You don't have to answer if too revealing

It’s just a trick of the camera  that’s a bog standard cardboard glove box, nothing hidden!

[Badwolf]

Clock has arrived. Taken a full week to get to me bl**dy Evr! (Ex Herpes!!). Just about to lodge a fleabay complaint as showing 'entered the system' for 4 days (yes I know about the rail stikes), when it turned up. Anyway. Lovely little thing looks the same as the one in the club shop at £108.00 (why so expensive, others are flogging them for £69) but only cost £20 plus carriage. Only thing with mine is that the flat button thingie is missing. Suits me as the stalk is still there to set the time, and now doesn't detract from the face. Just the job. Found a cutter in the garage and cut a slightly larger hole, 3mm deep and then cut the main hole through 52 mm dia. There was enough waggle in the drills so that it formed a very nice rebate and the clock fits nicely.

More to follow.

[Badwolf]

Another job off the list.

After spending a longer time working on this project than I expected, it is finally finished.  First there was the trial cutting using a piece of old floorboard....

The outer rebate was cut using a wood cutter with a 56mm blade in an old Black & Decker drill held on a stand, then a 52mm cutter used to go through.  So far so good. The clock fitted, so it was time (sorry, pun not intended) the do the deed.  The dashboard was marked up from the back by using the metal dash support as a template (as above).  I decided to go against originality and use the existing holes in the metalwork for the clock and the cigar lighter. I thought that drilling another hole in the metal was a step too far.

So with the guide drawings I worked out the centre of the holes and started drilling after covering the front with masking tape to try to protect the veneer.

I drilled a pilot hole through from the back and then, from the front first the outer rebate 3mm deep and then the inner, right through. The wobble of the old drill even in the stand was enough to form the rebate...

I ran a brown picture framers pen around the inside to colour the holes...

and then trial fitted the clock and the lighter.  Both fitted nicely.

but the lighter bit looked a bit too new, so it was distressed a little and everything was connected up, (I decided not to include the illuminated thingie on the lighter for a couple of reasons, the woodwork thickness fouled the bulb holder and would have to be thinned, the plastic collar that shows at the front was yellow when it should have been green, but it also increased the overall thickness of the unit) which took some time tracking down the suitable wiring to branch into, but...

..when fitted, I think that it turned out OK in the end.  I must retouch the glove box. I only realised how badly it was scuffed when I came to post the pictures. Yes the lighter should be down the bottom but it roughly follows the line of the heater controls so I am reasonably happy. Bit of polish and a rub over and there we are... oh, and the clock keeps good time... a bonus.  By the way, you can just make out the new courtesy light under the parcel shelf. There is a similar one on the driver's side, they are now working well and can be turned off when the doors are open when I am working inside, to stop the battery draining. Another job off the list.

[NonMember]

Nice job. Looks the biz.

[Chris A]

Yes they do look as if they were fitted at the factory, well done.

[Bordfunker]

Definitely looks factory!

Very nice.

Karl

[Badwolf]

Thank you all for your kind comments.

It just appears to take so long these days to do, well, anything. Tomorrow I will give the dash a rub over with scratch cover treatment and then a spray with a nice wax polish to finish and get rid of the paw marks. Might give the glove box the Lindsay treatment. A quick rub over with black boot polish. We will see. There is once again the possibility of kick starting that well documented failure...refurbing the hardtop. Oinck, oinck, flutter flutter. 🐷

[mark powell]

Beware of kick starting....   Achilles tendons don't always take kindly to it.... 😉

It's fun doing gauges though, isn't it?  Blank 18mm canvas on my Midge.

[Badwolf]

Since I have put everything back together, my overdrive can be a little unreliable. Touching the wires together in the gearstick, it switches in and out fine, so I suspect either the connections to the switch or the switch itself. Can the switch be stripped down and cleaned or is it just a case of drowning it in Servisol and hoping for the best?  I don't want to try opening it up as I know they are scarce/stupid money.