Bond Engine Rebuild

[dave.vitesse]

The first picture is from the solex Vitesse 6 using the heater outlet at the rear of the head.  The second shows the banjo arrangement on the later Vitesse.

Dave

[Colin Lindsay]

On 2/4/2018 at 5:26 PM, Steve P said:

Hmmm. is that BMC Green?,that`s what i used on my 2 engines.

Steve

And on my Herald Estate engine... it was cheap at an autojumble many years ago....

[Algy]

Thanks Dave,

You have confirmed with you photo's what I expected to see and with a trial fit of the manifold to the head there is not much room for the pipe (it would have to be a pig tail shape).

I also thank Anglefire as he made a good piont about being able to retro fit.

So will fit the blank that was fitted to spare head and make up a single banjo outlet unless anyone knows of a supplier, who has one.

[Algy]

Returning to the colour my block was green under a coat of gold and the head black under gold, so that is why I am returning the engine to that colour scheme.

A further part to the original cooling may have been the 6ozs of sand around number 6 cylinder; yes sand and it needed a hammer and punch to move it (black in colour under the rusty looking outer, so probably been in there since the block was cast). The ultrasonic clears said they got about 6 Table Spoons of sand / rust out during the 3 1/2 hour cleaning. We know it is not rust due to colour and it will not stick to a magnet.

I think Triumph sold Bond an engine that was a bit of a 2nd.

[Pete Lewis]

Most casting sand was 'blacking' presume made from sand and coal waste

My aunt had a blacking factory in dudley,  

So it was probaly black to start with ...

Pete

 

[Algy]

I think the casting sand has a bonding agent in it (like an oil), that turns to carbon when it is hit by liquid iron. The core plug holes are there so it can be removed, but in my engine's case, an apprentice on a bad day must have done the work at about 5PM Friday. The coolant flow wouldn't wash this out very well but there is a bit in the bottom of the radiator.

[JohnD]

Pete,

I was intrigued by your reference to 'blacking', as I always am by English usage.

'Blacking' is used in several surface  treatments, from shoe polish, to gun barrels, through narrow boat hulls.  Despite the name, they all use different processes and products to produce the desired effect.     "Blacking the grate", an esential part of good housewifery in the 'good' old days, used graphite rubbed into the metal of the stove, narrow boats were painted with bitumen, while the pigment in shoe polish is carbon black, soot.      The black colour of gun barrels and iron engine blocks is due to oxidation of the iron, not to ferrous oxide the familiar brown rust, but to magnetite, ferric oxide, which is harder and adheres better to the underlying native metal,  protecting it, and of course is black not red.

Thanks to Dickens, a blacking factory has become a synonym for crushing, exploitative labour in disgusting conditions (not in your aunties works, I'm sure, Pete!)

 

But to return to the block.   On Triumph sixes, that drain plug between 5 and 6 does fill with rust and corrosion, as it is the deepest point of the water jacket with little flow and it settles there, but is also the most difficult part to clean out of core sand.      When  preparing a block for rebuild, I always remove the plug and probe vigourously from above with a long screwdriver or similar, and usually wash out a sgnificant amount of, as Algy says, what is clearly sand and not rust.   Very worthwhile doing!

But what was in the casting sand?     The precise recipe is a part of the skill in a foundry, chosen to suit the metal and the product, but  in the day the major constituents of the  'binder' were clay and water!   Organic oils were used, with small quantities of mineral oils for special purposes.    Today, the binder may be acrylic resin, bonded with lasers!  See this interesting page from a company who will make you a bespoke engine block! : https://motivengines.wordpress.com/2014/05/30/sand-casting-the-engine-block/

John

[Algy]

Thanks John,

Very interesting Blog.

I thought it was casting sand as it was firmly bonded, very fine and black. If it was not from casting, they must have filled the car up at the beach or puddle in Iceland!

[dougbgt6]

Guys,

No rust crud in mine, just black grit and water trickle. Others tell me it IS casting sand. No amount of digging through the drain plug can shift it. I would like it out, but the head will have to come off to get at it as John suggests. Considering my block must have been like this for 45 years how urgent is it? I think of the drain as a sort of cul de sac off the main water jacket, the lowest point with minimal flow, So, does it matter that it's partially blocked? The only issue is that you can only drain the block VERY VERY SLOWLY through the drain. 

Doug

[Anglefire]

From my memories of casting when it could still be done at school before Elf and safety got its claws out, you used a fine black dust over the mould as a releasing agent and then fine sieved sand as a cover and then just sand to fill the "box"

[Algy]

Doug,

I would not worry about it but as the engine was in deep strip, it seemed logical to get rid of it. The ultrasonic clean did a fantastic job of remove the rest.

Mind you it did dissolve the push rod tubes in the head, so I have to turn up some replacements, they weren’t in the best condition anyway.

Anglefire,

Whan I did casting, we used French Chalk but some used graphite, but the sand did have an oil in it to make it stay in shape. I still cast the odd small alloy items, in my workshop.

[Anglefire]

 Perhaps it was white - so French chalk - Black, white, it’s all the same ?

 

[Pete Lewis]

On fitting new tubes bought or made , I would add a smear of loctite 574 to ensure the seal, dont use silcone its too slipperynand the tubes may move

574 sets solid once air is excluded.

Pete

[Algy]

May thanks for that info on the tubes Pete.

I was going to anneal the alloy and use a tapered drift to flair the ends top and bottom (as this head has been countersunk bores top and bottom, original is not, so unsure if this is normal or not). Fitment was going to be back to heating the head and chilling the tubes (back to the liquid nitrogen), but adding a bit of 574 wouldn’t go amiss.

I don’t use silicone much, I have seen too many sumps quilted due to excess silicone sealant being used and over torqueing bolts, in attempts to stop leaks. It has its uses but to me too many people over use the stuff, especially on fuel systems for some reason!

I recently had a Jaguar XK140 come in to my workshop with poor running and fuel dripping from one carb. On stripping it was obvious as to the cause, silicone sealant applied to the float chamber gasket, which had squeezed into the chamber and expanded and held the float down; making the engine run rich and the fuel to run out of the float chamber vent. To top it off the other two carbs had silicone smeared over the vent to stop fuel running out. The original fault, that had the owner go to a garage, was one float had a small hole in the soldered joint and had partly filled with fuel.

[Pete Lewis]

Whilst this was back in the 80/90s we did lots of gasket goo trials wirh many manufactured products and the 574 was by far the best 

In its day, eliminated paper joints on all face to face joints and sealed bolt threads , when   set/cured it can take a bit of effort to remove or split sealed joints 

But I love the stuff.  

Pete

[Algy]

Well the rocker shaft is rebuilt with new shaft and thankfully the new shaft must be on upper tolerance as the old rockers needed a little lapping to get the required fit (an unexpected turn out).

Please have a look at the pedestals, they are not the same as on the replacement head and from the number on them are the intermediate pedestals from a Mark 2 engine with one drilled for the oil way and a short sleeve has been fitted so they are centred on the stud. Another oddity of this engine!  

The pushrod tubes are finished, so ready when the head comes back from having new valve seats and guides. I have included a drawing for the tubes, which are an interference fit in my head, just in case anyone needs some.

tubes.pdf

[Pete Lewis]

Well, youve got a mk1 shaft ,  if it was a mk2 its longer  has some double pedestals each end

and the mk1 rocker cover wont fit a mk2 rocker set up.

Pete

 

[Algy]

Yes, I have fitted a Mk1 shaft and the rocker cover fits (well it is an alloy one and it did fit on the old head). This is as the old head was the shaft to head height is the same as the Mk1 pedestals (Pt # 128424). The part number on these is 144974 which should be the 2,3,4&5 pedestals for a Mk2, as I said though there is a sleeve fitted in each so they just fit the stud but it is only approximately 5/8” long and fitted half way up the hole. The rockers are not the same as the ones fitted to the spare head rocker shaft, but lighter (although do not appear modified, see earlier post photo) and do not match my mates 1600 engine rocker either (so no idea where they came from). I did reface the rocker pads as there was some signs of wear, but it was very light and only needed a very light touch on rocker dresser.

[Pete Lewis]

The wonders of mix and match 

Never seen sleeved pedestals  odd as the stud  132495  is same / common part across all 4cyl.   and 6 cyl engines 

Whatever they are  1147,   through 1600 mk1  mk2 range  and 2000+

Pete

[Algy]

This engine was definitely made up out of all sorts of bits. All the pedestals I have seen for 1600 and 2ltr Mk1 are wasted down the valve side of the upright under the rocker shaft. I think these bits must have been selected during the engine tune in 1971.

The size of the hole through is as you say the same size but this gives a small amount of wiggle space, the sleeve removes that clearance; I suspect they made the sleeves short so that the pedestals can seat flat on the head, should there be any error in the stud angle as you can rock them until they meet the head.

The engine had both a rocker breather to the inlet manifold (with valve) and a crankcase breather (like 1600).

[Pete Lewis]

If you want to fit a spin on oil filter you, need to modify the breather to clear it

Take it off and clean the flame trap  gauze filter fitted inside the mounting flange

Got some pic I can add when back on the laptop

If it has a smitths valve on the manifold  the crankcase breather must be blanked off or the inlet will be forever

Sucking air and making a very lean mixture  also needs a sealed oilmfiller not one with a gauze like theb1600 had 

 

Pete

 

[Algy]

I don’t want to modify the car, I am trying to keep it as it was back in 1971, when it was breathed on. I know it is a special but not like most (ie a home grown special) but a special built by Bond for Bond. With the new MOT rules coming up in May, if I keep it MOT exempt it may help keep the value.

So, no spin on oil filter.

Thank you for confirming my thoughts, felt it was over doing it and would end up with not just gas blown past the rings going into the inlet but air being drawn in through the breather, rather than air exiting the breather.

The oil filler is a sealed one, but what you have said, explains why the breather was fitted with a thin plate without holes (I thought that it had been fitted in error, obviously they found the engine running lean, and kept the breather rather then fitting the normal thick banking plate). I will refit it as it was, even if it looks and sounds mad, it is original (so will be fitted with the thin blanking plate).

[Pete Lewis]

Thats ok   .mk1 when the valve/ sealed breather was introduced a blanking plate was fitted as standard .OE

So long as you dont have both  a plate under the origial is fine

Pete

 

[Algy]

I have not been doing a lot on the engine as I have been working on cleaning up some of the steering components. Photo of the column. The steering wheel has also been reconditioned, which took and age.

But I have started looking at the carb's.

[Colin Lindsay]

That's beautiful, Algy, a lot of work has gone into that.