What O/D?.

[PeteH]

Hi. Been reading some of the posts ref; O/D. with that in mind the question Is:- Which Box/Drive combination would be suitable for a 13/60?. Where potentially would one source one, and from what vehicle?. Would it be necessary to change the Diff Ratio. Or not?. I have my own theories, but any experience would be beneficial?. Could one be built from the existing box with an Overdrive sourced seperately?.

Pete

[clive]

In no particular order:

Keep same diff, then you are effectively adding a 5th gear

If you use an OD box from a spit 1-3 it will be a 3 synchro box exactly as you have, and a vitesse 1600 prop is a near enough ideal fit. Or 2 litre vitesse prop with a change of flanges

Use a box from a mkIV spit and you get the better 4 synchro box. It has the larger output flange.Prop needs big front small rear flanges.

Use a spit 1500 box, and you will need a custom prop.

The 1500 box uses the J type OD, the others D type, but both more than adequate.

Rebuilding your box requires new mainshaft, OD adaptor plate as well as the OD. Requires a gearbox strip...

 

I have had several OD heralds, makes the cars better on faster roads and more relaxed.

More details available as and when needed. 

[Darren Groves]

10 hours ago, clive said:

If you use an OD box from a spit 1-3 it will be a 3 synchro box exactly as you have, and a vitesse 1600 prop is a near enough ideal fit. Or 2 litre vitesse prop with a change of flanges

 

 I tried this on my 13/60, it did fit but it was damn tight even with the engine as far forward as it would go. Ended up getting one made by Dave Mac Props with a sliding joint, cost around £130 and well worth it.

Darren

[clive]

Ah yes. I had a 3 rail in one herald, but it was poor, as was the 1200 spit engine it was attached to. Bout a dolomite 1500 engine and overdrive, swapped the sump and realised the single rail box is 1" longer so totally ran out of room. As I needed the car for work the next day, I made some 30mm spacers and shunted the engine forwards. Stayed that way for the next 2 years of my ownership, and AFAIK still like it 15 years on (I knew the owners up to 6 months ago)

But indeed, I think a brand new prop is really the way to go. A worn prop can cause untold misery.

[Pete Lewis]

One local ended up with a awful conversion by a trader who fitted a single rail 1500 spit box into his Herald

The gear remote sprcical socket was too low and the tunnel and gaitor blocked gear lever movement

IE the tunnel was too high or the box too low, cotton reels and mounts were all fine , the tunnel hole ended up a good few inches up the gearstick there was no room for any travel,   

I Ended up making  a  bigger hole and a leather gaitor to get all gears 

This two speed conversion nightmare was again a trader who didnt give a fig. But took a wad of cash.

Pete

[PeteH]

Tops marks, for response guys. I only posted out of curiosity.

I am more intrigued with the idea now, so maybe a few months of "shopping" on Flea bay is  called for.?

Just a question? As mine is a late (1970-1) build, should it have the 4sync Box?. Or did they use the 3 sync right up to the end?

The Gear box, No is GB 22693 or possibly G 322693, (can`t read my own writing!).

Pete

[clive]

Heralds all 3 synchro. (originally!)

Be aware that used boxes are a real lottery. Our local gearbox man has seen the good, bad and ugly. Including one with a overdrive with most of the innards gone, and the remains welded together to make a non-od od!And the layshaft pins are rarely re-usable. For some reason the ones in OD boxes suffer, but non-od don't nearly as much. Odd...

[JohnD]

Your present gearbox is an irrelevance, unless you wnat originality.     You can't bolt an O/d on the bcak of a non-O/d 'box, it needs a different output shaft etc.

A used one is likely to require a rebuild and that's not straightforward, so budget for a pro-job, or buy a reconditioned one.

Don't forget to ask yourself, how will I wire it in.

John

PS Ah!  I see that Clive and I are as of one miond on used O/d boxes!

[Colin Lindsay]

I'll throw my usual spanner in the works and confirm that my second-hand O/D box, purchased for £180 from a private seller back in 2003, is still working brilliantly... so it can be hit and miss to some extent, but not all doom and gloom. There are good used ones out there, but price will reflect the quality, so anything dead cheap is likely to be just that: dead. You may - depending on who you use - get more comeback from a reputable dismantler who will stand over the used parts if they turn out to be defective.

[Pete Lewis]

for guide prices see the TD ftchets ad in the courier for exchange geabox £380  and ex OD  Dtype £385  these are exchange prices  not outright buys 

need to ask them  , and does it include the adaptor housing  etc.

a mainshaft for  4 sync OD  is TKC923 from memory £ 100 - 190

main shaft for 3 syn OD  208142   £190

Pete

[PeteH]

On 19/02/2018 at 8:09 AM, clive said:

And the layshaft pins are rarely re-usable. For some reason the ones in OD boxes suffer, but non-od don't nearly as much. Odd...

Could be a function of the extra load stress an overdrive will inevitably place on what was originally designed?.

Looking at the Haynes Manual for the Vittesse. (1600). A rebuild whilst probably time consuming, not that much of an issue for one retired, does not look any more onerous than the Mini Gearbox, or the Fords which I have done in the past?. The biggest issue would be in my view access to the parts?, which in total could make the job non cost effective?. The current Non O/d box is an unknown quantity anyway, it selects all gears reasonably smoothly. But was already removed when I got the vehicle as the previous owner had already started the refurb;. And I shall probably fit it initially, to see how she goes. I would suspect it most unlikely that a Non O/D box would be acceptable as P-Ex for an O/D one!.

Thanks.

Pete

Edited February 21, 2018 by PeteH
spellin

[Dick Twitchen]

It may be worth contacting the gearbox/diff guru Mike Papworth,  EMail probably better than telephone and details are in the back of The Courier.  Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Dick

[68vitesse]

When I lost two teeth of the third gear on the layshaft cluster in my Vitesse gearbox l bought the parts for the repair from Mike Papworth. Found him very helpful and generous with his time and information, he offered to check all the components of the gearbox including the selector  mechanism.

Drove to his workshop, about 300 miles round trip, for the bits and checks then visited the motor museum while in Coventry.

Regards

Paul