Pete Lewis Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 with a 3 ohm coil you must have a full 12v supply and no pink wires or ceramic ballast resistor fitted if you check the ign supply at the coil the points must be closed or ( earth the dizzy lead ) if its open circuit you will read 12v when it may not be so. if you get around 6 -8 volts then the pink ballast is working and you need a 1.5 ohm coil ie run a 12v 3 ohm coil on 6 v and you get a weeny ht Spark. and poor running Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 My recommendation was if you needed a non-ballasted coil..... I can't remember what I had for breakfast let alone which cars use ballasted or non-ballasted coils! Does yours have the pink wire?? If so you may need a tweek to the wiring to give a 12v supply when running (use any white wire to feed the coil) But whatever, the Bosch should be a good quality bit of kit. At least Bosch is still a proper company.....for the time being, although there is a lot of fake bosch stuff about on ebay (notably fuel pumps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 and then some 6v coils are marked as 12v being the base car voltage ....mix and match minefield does anyone know what clive had for breaky bacon sarnie sounds a good start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougbgt6 Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 9 minutes ago, Pete Lewis said: does anyone know what clive had for breaky No, but he sounds quite perky. I could do with some. Cognac on the cornflakes? Ballast wire is dull white with a barely noticeable pink fleck. It goes to the coil or to the starter solenoid were it attaches to the white. Alternatively a ballast resistor attached to the bulkhead. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 Oh don't mention a bacon sarny Pete I'm starving. OK... Points closed, one probe on the coil +ve and one on the disconnected connector =11.4v Across +ve and -ve while both disconnected =3ohms Wires as per photo pink/white and yellow/white go to +ve. And the coil that Clive absolutely promised was exactly correct on the way. What do you reckon? I think it'll be a drop in job with no wiring mods? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 ... I've no idea what the grey/white one is, it's never been connected to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 16 minutes ago, ShaunW said: OK... Points closed, one probe on the coil +ve and one on the disconnected connector =11.4v I'm not quite sure what you actually tested here but I don't think you were supposed to disconnect anything. The test for ballast resistor (wire) is to have points closed, ignition on, all wires connected as normal, and measure the voltage from coil +ve to ground. That will give a result of ~12V (=Vbat) if not ballasted, ~6V (Vbat/2) if ballasted and the right coil, or ~8V (2/3 Vbat) if ballasted but a non-ballast coil is fitted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 Thx. 7.8v Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 So I've not been getting enough bang for my buck? So my wiring is ballasted? (sorry not knowing what that actually means is probably the reason I'm having a hard time with this) Ballasted wiring needs an unballested coil? Ballasted coils are for non ballasted cars? Or do the wiring and the coil need the same desegnation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 Starting to think it's always had the wrong coil, and I've just ordered one similar. D'oh. Clive should I lose the white/pink wire and leave it with just the white /yellow in place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 I have been informed I had muesli for brekky. (bacon only on a Saturday unless it is a special occasion) So, a ballasted system. You need to find an ignition switched 12V wire, I an pretty certain they are all white. That may perk thinks up for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougbgt6 Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 In the olden times when batteries weren't so good a system was designed to aid cold starting. When the engine is running the ignition uses 6 volts. But, as it starts 12 volts is applied to the ignition giving a fatter spark. To achieve 6 volts a ballast resistor or ballast wire is used to drop the voltage. The coils are different for ballasted and non ballasted systems, resistance across the ballasted coil is around 1.5 ohms, non ballasted around 3 ohms. The wrong coil on the wrong system is not good! Ballasted coils for ballasted wiring. Local shops for local people. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 Thx Doug. New non ballasted 3ohm coil on the way (as per Clive's link) and my wire cutters are poised and ready to cut #7. Everyday's a school day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglefire Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 You can’t just do that as the electrical flow is normally via the ballast and effectively the ballast is shorted out when starting. So what you need to do is bridge the ballasted wire and not cut it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 By bridge it do you mean to effectively replace the KW wire #7 with regular wire. With no need to actually remove it because of electricity following the path of least resistance? I'm making this simple job seem like bl**dy hard work aren't I? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougbgt6 Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 24 minutes ago, ShaunW said: By bridge it do you mean to effectively replace the KW wire #7 with regular wire. Yes! Unfortunately one end is on the ignition switch which is a bugger to get at. Never mind, next time someone has this problem on the forum you'e going to be the first to respond, being a newly trained expert. I learn something most days on here. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 11, 2018 Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 You may be able to find a suitable ignition-switched supply somewhere more convenient than the switch. Look for a plain white wire. Or use a ballast-type coil - they do help starting if your battery is a tad weak. Incidentally, the mystery "never been connected" white with a grey stripe wire in your photo... could that be a faded white/black? If so, it's the one between 8 (coil) and 9 (distributor) in the wiring diagram. Somebody has bypassed it with a red/yellow for reasons unknown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2018 NM that red/yellow wire is actually orange. The photo has been affected by an unusual meteorological phenomenon which I believe people are calling 'sunshine'. Yep Doug bring on those coil questions.... But I hope they're soon before I forget it all. As a footnote to this rollercoaster of dispair and enlightenment.... I think I might swap the unballested coil I ordered for a ballasted one. If they have advantages it seems a bit silly to downgrade. Now hopefully....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougbgt6 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Shaun, The reason for the ballasted system doesn't really exist anymore, we just stick with it because that's what we've got and it's a pain and an expense to change. It was all a long time ago (in a galaxy far far away). Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 I don't know that the reason "doesn't exist anymore". Nothing's really changed except that we tend to keep our batteries in better condition. I've certainly had cars with weak batteries quite recently and the ballast system does help them. Modern engines don't use ballast resistors because the clever computer adjusts the dwell time dynamically to suit the battery voltage. And they DO use more dwell during cranking to achieve the same result as the ballast bypass switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 and should you ever go to a electronic points the modules really need a 12v supply 6v is right at the lower end of their operational range normally they have a range of 6-18v on abalsted feed its easy to get below the 6v limit and a 12v bypass is normally on the cards and a 3 ohm coil . Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougbgt6 Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 56 minutes ago, NonMember said: Nothing's really changed except that we tend to keep our batteries in better condition No we don't! We ignore our batteries until they fail. They are cheaper and very much improved from those that originally came with our cars. We don't have to check the fluid and top them up to keep them in A1 condition and they work better at lower temperatures. All of which means the ballasted system isn't really necessary any more. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Modern batteries are better but they still suffer discharge and can still be found wanting during cranking. That's why, as I pointed out, all modern cars still take action to cope with low cranking voltage, which is what the ballast system is about. It wasn't "necessary" in the 1960s or the 1970s but it was, and still is, beneficial in some conditions. I'm fairly sure my Vitesse would have started before we moved house, if it had a ballasted ignition system. It was cranking over fine, and the only thing I did to it after moving was the change the battery again. This is an absolutely classic case of why they introduced the ballasted coils, and was only two years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 in 55 years of driving my only non starter was my first Minx, at less than £3 a week apprentice pay it took 2 weeks to save up the 12/6d for a Blue Star battery, so out in the snow with the cranking handle and swing it over the only ballast was a tigers tail , who needs a ballast . keep all the basics in place and serviced and it will start ...every time what ever the badge . that is until they devised sensors for everything and ECU to blow up ,and ERG to jam etc ....the good old days more fun less hassle Pete Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunW Posted June 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 23 hours ago, NonMember said: You may be able to find a suitable ignition-switched supply somewhere more convenient than the switch. Look for a plain white wire. It's pretty close, fuse 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now