RAW1969 Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 Thanks Pete. I need to be very wary of tasks escalating into other jobs so will hold the thought on taking the valve apart and just rig it to stay open for now whilst I finish the flushing. The next challenge I could do with some advice on is as follows.... I can't seem to get the radiator tap open anymore. The steel "key" no longer bites on the brass tap shaft. Think it's finally rounded it off? So i want to get the whole thing out to replace. Another awkward spot to work. Can't really see what size spanner the drain tap needs though. I'm somewhere around 14mm, 1/2", 9/16" or even 1/4w. Don't want to round off what's left of the flats (if there are any) and non of the above give me confidence to apply any force. Any suggestions? Would it be easier to bite the bullet and take the radiator out? Thanks Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 my spare tap is 9/16af rad out is most likely if the tap is tight you can rip the soldered collar off the bottom tank , apply some gentle heat may help, not too much or the tanks solder will melt getting the rad out of a Vitesse is a cunning dark art requires the engine turning to extricate the bottom pipe past the fan, , so its in gear shove a bit lift a bit shove a bit lift a bit more as they say refitting is the reverse, you guessed you need six pairs of hands there a little more space with a metal fan than plastic but plastic makes gravity and the blade angle help/ easier to refit Peet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Caswell Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 Slide a sheet of hardboard or similar down the back of the rad before trying to lift it out will save mangling the fins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 chicken and egg problem, you could always remover the fan first...just need the rad out to get on the bolts .. you cant win good tip about the hardboard Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAW1969 Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 Ok. Thanks. That's a setback. Most things I can find on EBay or Rimmers etc but 4 extra hands I will struggle with! Spurred on by the thought of having to get the help from a garage I had one more go. Not for the purists (or the squeamish) but I've got the tap free with mole grips on its threads. So at least it's drained. Pete on your spare tap can you see how the steel key is attached to the brass tap shaft please? Also does the tap unscrew right out of the brass housing? Wondering if I might be able to either fix the key back on or just replace the bit that turns - leaving the 9/16 housing where it is. Hoping to get back on the road whilst the weather stays. Cheers Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daverclasper Posted August 5, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 Hi. Just wondering. My rad tap is seized to some lesser or more extent , though I just undo bottom hose to drain. Am I missing something?. Cheers, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 The tap is supposed to allow you to drain the system without disturbing the hoses, so as not to cause damage or maybe aggravate wear etc, and you can also attach a small pipe to it to drain the coolant responsibly... fine when they work but if not, undo the hose... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 The threaded part will not be removable from the brass as the end is bigger than the thread to make the gland to seal when its screwed closed. The turn key is staked lightly onto a plain shank at the end of the brass threaded portion Not made for gorrilla use , Histoically they are pretty hopeless due to infrequent useage. Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAW1969 Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 Thanks all. A very practical alternative re using the hose to drain instead. Its so easy to focus on the problem at hand and not see the bigger picture! Can still catch drainkng coolant in washing up bowl I guess. All back together tonight and filled with water to check for leaks. Idled for 10 minutes. Will do the chemical flush tomorrow then see if the temp gauge is under control. Thanks Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Caswell Posted August 5, 2018 Report Share Posted August 5, 2018 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROVER-P4-P5-P5B-P6-RADIATOR-ENGNE-BLOCK-WATER-DRAIN-BRASS-TAP-/372267345457 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAW1969 Posted August 11, 2018 Report Share Posted August 11, 2018 Just to come back on this. Very useful picture of the drain tap. Thanks Ben. So all drained again (left the tap for now as is works with fingers). Flushed with Holts speed flush then drained, flushed again and filled with coolant. So now to test.... Idled in garage for 10 mins. Needle on temp gauge a few degrees to the left of vertical. So took to the road. Gentle lap around the block (about a mile). Needle moved a few degrees to the right of vertical. So getting warmer. Pinking in third when asked to pull. Not got up to the H on gauge though so that looks a bit better. Would really like to run with temp guage needle vertical. No reason just feels right to me. So next step. Take out water pump to see what state that's in. Does that sound sensible? Thanks Richard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted August 11, 2018 Report Share Posted August 11, 2018 apart from theres little to go wrong or wear unless the bearings are failing, ive never see an vane failures and you should have looked when it was drained first time round if the engine is not hot remove gauge bezel and move the needle your too far away but thee is a proper smiths test box that tests the sender and all needle positions , eg calibrate to the 2 little dots on the scale Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gully Posted August 11, 2018 Report Share Posted August 11, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, RAW1969 said: Just to come back on this. Very useful picture of the drain tap. Thanks Ben. So all drained again (left the tap for now as is works with fingers). Flushed with Holts speed flush then drained, flushed again and filled with coolant. So now to test.... Idled in garage for 10 mins. Needle on temp gauge a few degrees to the left of vertical. So took to the road. Gentle lap around the block (about a mile). Needle moved a few degrees to the right of vertical. So getting warmer. Pinking in third when asked to pull. Not got up to the H on gauge though so that looks a bit better. Would really like to run with temp guage needle vertical. No reason just feels right to me. So next step. Take out water pump to see what state that's in. Does that sound sensible? Thanks Richard Sounds as though you're absolutely fine on temps - wouldn't mess any further! I would, however, sort the pinking - lean running can lead to hotter running. Gully PS. In this hot weather my GT6 runs around the 2/3 mark and I can watch the temperature modulation of the thermostat on the gauge. Even sitting in traffic on a hot day it doesn't move above 3/4 - 40+ years old gauges really are just an indication. Many moderns don't even have them - just a warning light - and those that do have heavily damped ones Edited August 11, 2018 by Gully Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Twitchen Posted August 11, 2018 Report Share Posted August 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Gully said: my GT6 runs around the 2/3 mark and I can watch the temperature modulation of the thermostat on the gauge. Even sitting in traffic on a hot day it doesn't move above 3/4 - 40+ years old gauges really are just an indication Exactly the same on mine (50+ years!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave.vitesse Posted August 11, 2018 Report Share Posted August 11, 2018 The sender resistance values are. Full/Hot = 20 Ohms. (How much)/(Yes Boiling!) Half/Normal = 72 Ohms. (Some still left)/(82 C) Empty/Cold = 270 Ohms. (Must fill up)/(Must change that stat) Disconnect the sender and (Substitute) connect a resistor of one of the above values to earth to check the gauge. You can test the sender in a container fill with hot water a thermometer and a multi-meter set to 2k ohm range. Or just change the sender if it is suspect. This info may help. On the other hand it could confuse! Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted August 11, 2018 Report Share Posted August 11, 2018 4 hours ago, Pete Lewis said: apart from theres little to go wrong or wear unless the bearings are failing, ive never see an vane failures and you should have looked when it was drained first time round if the engine is not hot remove gauge bezel and move the needle your too far away but thee is a proper smiths test box that tests the sender and all needle positions , eg calibrate to the 2 little dots on the scale Pete Pump itself can be fine but the impeller needs to be a close fit to the housing for it to function properly. This housing can occasionally be corroded or eaten away by cavitation. Would probably check gauge calibration first though. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted August 13, 2018 Report Share Posted August 13, 2018 On 8/11/2018 at 12:14 PM, RAW1969 said: So next step. Take out water pump to see what state that's in. Does that sound sensible? Thanks Richard You may find the housing solidly blocked with crud that the flusher hasn't removed, but as Pete says it would have made more sense to do this when first drained. It's worth a look for peace of mind though. Make sure you have a new gasket and three new lockwashers for refitting, otherwise it may start to leak after being disturbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted August 13, 2018 Report Share Posted August 13, 2018 get some new bolts as they can shear off removing the pump just to keep things exciting as colin says , seal the threads on refitting Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAW1969 Posted August 13, 2018 Report Share Posted August 13, 2018 As always this forum proves invaluable to me. Another short run yesterday and results were the same. Thinking now that I'm veering towards "if it ain't broke don't fix it" territory. Plenty more things to be getting on with before i start on making new leaks and shearing bolts! That can wait for winter I think ? Thanks Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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