That was a year that was..

[Bfg]

20th April :

I'm leaving bigger jobs until after i move next week  ..but yesterday saw particularly beautiful spring weather and so I took the opportunity for a little pottering around on the TR. 

I started off with freeing up the seized pivots to the rear stay of the folding hood frame. This stay (supposedly) hinges out of the back of the main loop to hold the rear window up.  These brackets had been ripped off before and both had weld repairs, so it is a little surprising that for the sake of a drip of oil (literally just a drip) it was left to happen again. . . 

^ This had happened on both sides, although the other side bracket is still just about clinging on.  In due course I'll take the hood frame off and weld them up again.  In the meantime I crudely used a pair of plumber's grips to rotate the pivot as I dripped oil in.  I was surprised at just how much force, with 8" of leverage, it took to get each pivot to move. Eventually, with lubrication, they turned freely in my fingers.  Interestingly ..or not, there are 11 pivots on either side of these (TR6) hood frames that need a drip of oil every five or ten years, particularly on hood frames that are rarely put up or down.

My next little task was to adjust the steering column.  As I now have the seat right the way back, moving the steering wheel back too will give me much better clearance between it and my leg.  The TR has a split steering column inner-shaft with sliding flats on its two parts, and a clamp to hold that position.  The steering column's outer sleeve has U-clamps, which may be loosened and the column pulled out (wheel closer / shorter arm reach) or pushed further in to the dashboard.  It's not a very convenient but it is a great boon for those who are not of average size or proportion.  As I wanted to see what those clamps were and I can't see around bends (even after sucking a lemon) nor in the dark - I took a photo. . .

^ That light grey block is the column's clamp at the dashboard. There is another where the column comes through the bulkhead. This one has through-bolts so I needed to hold a spanner on the bolt head as I slackened off the nut.  I'll have to see if those bolts were originally captive or perhaps square headed, so as to not turn, because as it was this was an awkward little episode !   The clamp at the bulkhead was much easier ..although I couldn't see it, it felt more like a u-bolt, so just a 3/8" drive socket on its extension undid that easily. 

I've been advised that the stay to the dashboard clamp is incorrectly positioned, and that it shouldn't cross at an angle to the column, but for the time being I'll live with it ..and just get on and adjust the column's position

^ From the engine bay's side of the bulkhead this is the steering column's outer sleeve, protruding (as it was) by about 80mm. The clamp which holds the two parts of the steering column shaft in place is that block with the two bolts through it.  The rubber doughnut / coupling can be seen to the bottom right of the picture.  And Katie's  new heater hoses, now with original type wire clips, is across the top of this piccie. Yes the instrument cable was just hanging loose and being chafed by the coupling.

After my adjustment ; the column's protrusion is now about 38 mm, so I've pulled the steering wheel and column, with its switches, back by 42mm (just over 1-1/2").  I'll try it there and see how it feels.  Just sitting in the driver's seat - it feels much better clearance but whether the reach for my arms is now comfortable or too close remains to be seen (.. or felt !).

While, focused on the steering column, it was a good opportunity to replace those rubber couplings, after all they were not probably not replaced when the car was restored 22 years ago. . .

 

^ I'm sure they had years of service still in them but I'm just replacing any perished rubber I see ..so that I can drive the car and feel a little more reassured by its reliability and safety.   You'll see above that the bolts had not been lock wired. And I saw no evidence that thread lock had been used, nor were there lock washers, instead.

^ The old and the new.  The hole through the centre is where the horn's earthing wire goes through the rubber coupling (rather than around the outside where it might get snagged). 

I'd guess the old rubber had deformed a little because when I reassembled the coupling with the new rubber I needed to use a B&D Workmate to pinch the holes closer together (by about 3mm (1/8") before i could get the bolt through.  Of course it may just be that the new rubber is of metric dimension.  Anyway they went together fine. 

^ The reassembled coupling with new rubber and its bolts cross lock-wired.  NB.  if you're doing this task, do have a 1.5mm drill-bit ready to clean out the holes for the lock wires.  One had a wire broken off inside and it took almost an hour to drill it out.  I had just one drill-bit of that size, and of course they do bend and break off very easily ..I was lucky.  The braided earth-wire can just be seen ..tucking in between the metal and going through the centre of the rubber.  That wire has an eye connector on each end which fits below a bolt head into either side splined clamp. 

I replaced both couplings.  ^ This was the bottom one, close to the steering rack. It's easily removed, to be rebuilt on the bench, by undoing the clamp bolt nearest the rack and simply tapping the coupling upwards off its spline, together with the column's shaft (the top coupling having already been removed).  You can see here that one of its splines onto the shaft was loose, and wearing every looser.  When the rubber was replaced, I reassembled it by reversing the couplings, top to bottom. Their slight difference in fit tightened everything up nicely.

^ another job done.  Because I working outside my apartment block I didn't have my spare nuts n' bolts & washers for those clamps, but these are now easily accessible to be swapped-out in due course.  Likewise the cable strap holding the instrument cable away from the coupling is just temporary. 

That's it for yesterday.

Pete.

[Colin Lindsay]

55 minutes ago, Bfg said:

That's it for yesterday.

Pete.

That's enough for any day. A few jobs well done!

[poppyman]

I don't know how you do it Pete... as well as being outside and then posting on here  

Tony.

[Bfg]

If it's any consolation.,  I didn't get much of anything done today.  Being woken at 5:15am by a neighbour readying themselves for early morning work (..poor sod), and then not getting back to sleep ..until after my alarm went off.  And then not waking up until quarter to eleven.  Not a good start to my day,  so I wrote what I posted and then went out to combat a clatter - the bonnet which rattles n' shakes more than a ice cocktail in a smashed shaker. .

Upon investigation I found this . . . 

^ The keen eyed observer will note its lock nut ..fully unscrewed.  I wound the dovetail latch (screwdriver in its end slot) back in by 3-1/2 turns, tried the bonnet for its closed fit, before tightening that lock-nut.  Now the bonnet pulls down to the rubbers on both sides rather than bouncing around on the sprung latch. 

Funny how that job took 10 minutes to identify, look up in the manual how to adjust it, and then do the job and it makes more difference than 8 hours working on the car yesterday. !

I then made a couple of urgent phone calls to the TR Register's office, re my passwords on that website, before taking the car out to a farm shop for my green groceries. Back via the dust bowl / my storage container to sort out and collect tools and bits for the next tasks I want to tackle.   

During that little drive, the bonnet rattle is many times better ..so that I can now more clearly hear numerous other tappeties, rattles, and whirring noises.  

And the steering wheel is now sufficiently clear of my leg.  In fact I wonder if it might go forward again by half an inch as a better compromise to a slightly straighter arm driving position.  Should anyone find their steering heavy at parking speeds - they might try bringing their steering wheel closer. The geometry and ergonomics of doing this makes the steering a good bit easier as such speeds.   

By the way, I propose adhering anti-drum / sound deadening to the underside of the bonnet .. Any recommendations ?  Nothing that looks too modern please.

Cheers, Pete

 

[Paul H]

1 hour ago, Bfg said:

If it's any consolation.,  I didn't get much of anything done today.  Being woken at 5:15am by a neighbour readying themselves for early morning work (..poor sod), and then not getting back to sleep ..until after my alarm went off.  And then not waking up until quarter to eleven.  Not a good start to my day,  so I wrote what I posted and then went out to combat a clatter - the bonnet which rattles n' shakes more than a ice cocktail in a smashed shaker. .

Upon investigation I found this . . . 

^ The keen eyed observer will note its lock nut ..fully unscrewed.  I wound the dovetail latch (screwdriver in its end slot) back in by 3-1/2 turns, tried the bonnet for its closed fit, before tightening that lock-nut.  Now the bonnet pulls down to the rubbers on both sides rather than bouncing around on the sprung latch. 

Funny how that job took 10 minutes to identify, look up in the manual how to adjust it, and then do the job and it makes more difference than 8 hours working on the car yesterday. !

I then made a couple of urgent phone calls to the TR Register's office, re my passwords on that website, before taking the car out to a farm shop for my green groceries. Back via the dust bowl / my storage container to sort out and collect tools and bits for the next tasks I want to tackle.   

During that little drive, the bonnet rattle is many times better ..so that I can now more clearly hear numerous other tappeties, rattles, and whirring noises.  

And the steering wheel is now sufficiently clear of my leg.  In fact I wonder if it might go forward again by half an inch as a better compromise to a slightly straighter arm driving position.  Should anyone find their steering heavy at parking speeds - they might try bringing their steering wheel closer. The geometry and ergonomics of doing this makes the steering a good bit easier as such speeds.   

By the way, I propose adhering anti-drum / sound deadening to the underside of the bonnet .. Any recommendations ?  Nothing that looks too modern please.

Cheers, Pete

 

Silentcoat from Amazon or EBay , cut shape with scissors and heat with hot air gun . I used a wallpaper seam roller to smooth the silentcoat into the contours of the body 

Paul 

 

[Bfg]

2 hours ago, Paul H said:

Silentcoat from Amazon or EBay , cut shape with scissors and heat with hot air gun . I used a wallpaper seam roller to smooth the silentcoat into the contours of the body 

Paul 

Thanks Paul, 

At 6kg/sq.m for a 4mm thick sheet certainly is sound deadening "mass".  As the bonnet is probably 2 sq.m or more., how much of it do you think needs to be covered for it to be effective. 

Pete

[Paul H]

7 minutes ago, Bfg said:

Thanks Paul, 

At 6kg/sq.m for a 4mm thick sheet certainly is sound deadening "mass".  As the bonnet is probably 2 sq.m or more., how much of it do you think needs to be covered for it to be effective. 

Pete

I did the interior of my Vitesse . All the floor space plus bulkhead where available and practical . With the benefit of hindsite and more research I could have saved up to 50%
Paul 

[Colin Lindsay]

I used Dodomat, £29 off eBay for 20 sheets; I reckon that would do the entire floorpan and sides etc of one of our cars. Very easy to use and the shiny silver side looks neat.

[Paul H]

13 hours ago, Bfg said:

Thanks Paul, 

At 6kg/sq.m for a 4mm thick sheet certainly is sound deadening "mass".  As the bonnet is probably 2 sq.m or more., how much of it do you think needs to be covered for it to be effective. 

Pete

Not sure what thickness I used as away from the Vitesse think it was 2mm

Paul

[Bfg]

^ I reckon this car will need a lot of panel deadening.  Everything sound like an empty tin.  It's quite amazing that such seemingly flimsy panels have lasted so well over the past five and a half decades. 

- - -

21st April :

This afternoon I had a few hours so tackled a floor .. and it beat me to the ground ..boom boom,   I'll be here all week folks !

. . .

  Sorry, I'm obviously in need of a tall shot of brandy.  Barman, a pint please !

Anyways up.. since having the gearbox out to do the clutch I've neither refitted the gearbox cover, the carpets, the dashboard support H-frame, or the passenger's seat.  I wasn't keen when I saw the floors painted still in primer, and the driver's floor had obviously suffered at some time as a consequence of wet feet on carpet with felt underlay.  The gearbox tunnel will be coming out again soon after I move, but today I sought to clean up the passenger footwell and get some decent paint on it.  At the same time I might closely inspect it for rust or failure.  With its under-felt removed, this is what I had . . .

   

^ The handwriting next to the chassis mount appears to be two dates, 27-10-98 and then 19-06-99, which correspond to when the car was restored and these floors were replaced, some 21 years ago.  The car has been garaged since and all the floors are still in good shape. 

This, passenger footwell, is better than that of the driver's. And like that side, these carpets had been screwed down, ie., self tappers through the panels, some of which were rusting.  Personally I don't like self tappers through the car's panel - not least because they initiate rust, but also because the pointy ends always seem to find a way of making painful holes in my skin. 

I also don't like fitted footwell carpets in an open top car.  Such cars, particularly older British ones, have a habit of getting sodden inside, so from the day I first had a Mk.II Spitfire (of the Triumph variety, rather than Supermarine) I've often had to take the carpets out to drip dry. And that's also useful on the rare occasion I actually brush them off.

Below these screwed carpets was appears to be natural fibre under-felt.  And that was glued in with something incredibly hard and beige looking.  I remember using a foaming glue in boat-building at one time, and this stuff appears to be equally as hard, and as determined not to chip off.  I exaggerate not when I say it took me 2-1/2 hours to chisel the lumps off ..just this one floor (the adhesive ridges were generally a couple of mm high) . . .

 

^ Yes the floor does appear to be buckled. I need to investigate that rear chassis mount anyway. 

In the top left hand corner you'll note a dark line between the sill and the side kick plate.  That is a gap of flaky rust and so fails to be structural.  It will at some time need to be cut out and repaired.  

The hole in the middle of the floor is a left-over from the early model of TR and was used jack the car up. The chassis on those cars was immediately besides the hole and the jack had a pin which locked into it.  The TR4A (this car) had a different chassis and no such jacking point, but the floors are a common part.

I had also been down under in the footwell with my cordless drill and wire brush to clean off the underside of the bulkhead (the underside of the shelf where the battery sits).  There was only light surface rust up there and otherwise places where the car's original conifer green paint could be seen. 

I wiped the floor over with acetone, particularly where it was grubby from where the gearbox had been lifted out.   And then I donned my old hat and rubber gloves to get in there and paint it. . .

^ it's not Hammerite, but POR15.  Just a thin coat rubbed in to the crevices (except that one seam that needs to be repaired).  And yes it does look sorta awful ..but on the other hand I trust the product and it will reflect light up under the dashboard for when I investigate wiring and other jobs in there.  

Unfortunately. . .

 

The big rubber bung had been sealed with black silicon sealant and although I'd cleaned it off and wiped it over with acetone., the silicon residue clearly wasn't cleaned off well enough.  Indeed my hasty efforts to clean the whole floor with acetone may have just served to spread the silicon around, all over the place, because this paint now has fish-eyes.. all over the place.       I flipping hate silicon sealant. 

There's nothing I can do about it right now. I'll wait until the POR15 is cured and then wipe it over again with acetone to see if I can shift the silicon before giving it a second coat.  Hey ho. such are the joys of chemical reactions. 

Bidding you a good evening.

Pete.

[Badwolf]

Pete - I have posted a picture on a Spitfire bonnet with SilentCoat sound deadening on the underside, on another thread here. You might have seen it. I am not at my PC at the moment but if it is of any help, I will post it here tomorrow for you.

[Bfg]

^ Thanks, yes please i would be glad to see what you've done on the underside of your bonnet..

 

Friday 23rd :

another little job tackled today was the exhaust rattling, but first I unpacked my new trolley-jack . . .

^ crumpled box but otherwise looking good.  I was surprised to see absolutely no brand or business name nor address, so perhaps this product is specifically sold to other companies who slap their own branding on it. Anyway I'm glad I bought from a reputable company ..just in case I have issues.

Nice tool, and yes at 35kg it's reasonably heavy to carry but once you have a grip and straighten up it's tolerable .. after all I'm not planning on dancing with it.   

^ my friend Rich kindly lent me a pair of brand new axle stands too, so after a block was placed under the front tyre and I'd found some packing pieces of softwood timber from a broken pallet - I was good to go.  The photo doesn't really show it but this apartment block's car park is both uneven and it has a fair slope to it.  

The cause of the rattle was clear, with the pipe having self adjusted (possibly initiated when the engine was jacked up to have the gearbox removed) and was then just touching the chassis' T-shirt plate.   Its rectification was equally as simple insomuch as I loosened the clamps to the rear cross-box silencer and lifted it clear (slight twist) and redid the clamps back up again.  So., another case of a simple five minute job having a more noticeable effect than spending hundreds of pounds and many frustrating hours of work..  Weird how that sometimes happens ..but I'm glad it does because it sorta helps balance things out.

That done I refitted the indicator relay, I'd moved out of the way when painting yesterday, and went shopping.  

Stuart, on the TR Register website replied to yesterday's paint reaction to silicon "The only way to get rid of silicone properly is a real silicone killer as acetone wont do anything, this is what I use Silicon cleaner "

Thank you to Stuart, his recommendation worked out well for me today ..  because I phoned my nearest / usual motor factors and they didn't have silicon cleaner in aerosol.  One company wanted £8 for 100ml pot of the stuff and another £11 of 200ml pot ..so I persevered looking for an aerosol and in doing so found a Wurth trade outlet here in Ipswich ..but they didn't answer the phone.  I needed to go out to a cash-point machine anyways so took the TR out for a run.  Got half the cash I needed, got some groceries, got some petrol and then went off to find this trade counter.. to see if they have a tin of the silicon cleaner, and whether they would sell to a private individual.

They would sell to me, but they didn't have an aerosol in stock.  However they did have a 1 litre tin of the same stuff, and the very kind man let me have it for the same price as the aerosol would have cost ..just £6.  I think I got a bargain there so also bought a can of carb cleaner which I frequently use. 

From there I went around to a car-paint supplier and had them colour-match Katie's signal red as a 1k to fill an aerosol can for me and to provide a small pot of touch up paint.  At £12.95 + VAT for 400ml., that was more expensive than I expected, but I guess nowadays aerosol paints are no longer cheap n' cheerful ..and this is specifically matched to the car and hand blended.

So that's it for today, a nice little run around in the sunshine, one less rattle (although that cross-box silencer really ought to have a bracket on both ends because otherwise it will only twist around again) ..and I heard the indicator relay for the first time today !  Also materials in before the weekend so I can carry on with painting the footwells / floors at my leisure.   Progress

So I bid you a good weekend., and happy travels for anyone participating in the 'Drive It Day' tomorrow.  I'll not be, but only because I have to go up the coast to collect some other bits and I need a bigger vehicle for those. 

Pete.

Edit :  'Drive It Day' is NOT tomorrow, but is on Sunday. Sorry my error.

[Bfg]

24th April :  6 hours before the Californian presidential primaries .. no wait.,  that's the wrong channel.  .. oh here we are.. Triumph exploits in Ipswich, Suffolk. . .

 

No work today, gorgeous weather.. I need to pack to move house tomorrow / Monday and I needed to get to the cash-point machine and at the same time be an hour up the coastline to GO SHOPPING !  

Fortunate timing on my part, sometime during this past mid-week.. I was the first to message a former TR owner about his classified advert on that register's website.  A very pleasant gentleman, John, was offering a TR4 - TR5 Surrey top and back-light ..offering the style and combination of open-top motoring with practicality I was hoping for.  For those not familiar with Triumph's TR4,  their Surrey Top, in layman's terms, is a fore-runner to the  "targa-top" + rear window surround, not at all dissimilar to that offered by Porsche on their 911 from 1965.  Triumph's Surrey top has been attributed to Michelotti (who styled the TR4) and a version was shown on his prototype ..which dates from 1960 or thereabouts, but of course Edwardian horseless carriages way-back-when, had their chauffeur outside the occupant's solid-structure carriage, with a canvas cover over him (..if he was lucky).

Porsche further developed the idea, insomuch as they incorporated structural roll-over protection in their rear window surround and they also made the removable folding-roof section rather more sophisticated than Standard-Triumph' s rag top.  I believe their rear window also folded down (again as did some Edwardian carriages).  But still, the essence of having a back-light + removable top, is much the same.  Triumph's rear window surround was in cast aluminium and simply bolted on (was not fold down). Those are now very  expensive  ..if you can find one in good condition being offered for sale. 

The one advertised was a repro item in fibreglass, but also with a glass wrap-around window.  The fabric top was with it, together with the bows which fit between the back-light and the windscreen's header rail.  The soft-top hood on my TR4A is off a TR6 and its header rail has different fastenings, but the seller was also including the front bar of a TR6 hood frame so that the top might be adapted..  Revington TR offer the same < here >.

All that said . . .

    

^  here it is, bought and paid for, and collected in my mobile garden shed.   Its surround, I'm told, is finished in Primrose yellow.  Not ideal., whereas off-white would probably have worked on a signal red car. The glass is presently loose in the surround, and so it wouldn't be the end of the world to remove it altogether and to spray the fibreglass surround with an aerosol.  The black vinyl resting on bedding just behind it., is the Surrey top.  

I did have a quick look-see ..with it resting loosely on the car, but not sitting down properly because of the lift-a-dot fastenings from the soft-top. Unfortunately I'd accidentally switched camera's auto-focus off.   Oops !  Never-the-less I'm sure you can get the idea, below . . .

 

^ a TR4A (IRS model) with overdrive and Surrey top, and so once everything is sorted - It'll be just what I wanted ...So I'm well chuffed  

Pete.

[Colin Lindsay]

33 minutes ago, Bfg said:

No work today, gorgeous weather.. I need to pack to move house tomorrow / Monday and I needed to get to the cash-point machine and at the same time be an hour up the coastline to GO SHOPPING !    

It never stops - but a glorious day indeed! Finished cleaning the back room that has just received a new ceiling, cut all my grass, took a load of rubbish to the dump - in fact two trailer fulls - watered all the pot plants, weeded the front flowerbed, and have just finished in time to have a very welcome beer, plus an excellent Chicken Dansak and will now wait for dark to go out meteor spotting. I can feel my forehead burning from the sun - I'll regret that later.

Good luck with the packing and moving, here's to a quick settling in and back to normality.

[Bfg]

38 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said:

here's to a quick settling in and back to normality.

Please.. not back to normality .. I need a rest from my " normal "  ! 

. . .

. .

Are you suggesting a meteor shower is expected tonight.?   If so I'll pop out myself and have a look. 

Pete

[Bfg]

27 minutes ago, Mathew said:

Well done, a good find that compliments the car well. Would you spray red to blend in or black? Or white?

Looks like your well on your way now to your ideal car. Its been a long road but the end is now in sight.

Thanks Mathew, 

I had plans to respray the car at some time, but for the time being I'm focused on recommissioning and sorting out the many issues so she'll be as safe and reliable as might be practical. So at this conjuncture I'm perhaps tempted aerosol spray the back-light frame an old-English white. 

[Badwolf]

On 22/04/2021 at 20:12, Badwolf said:

Pete - I have posted a picture on a Spitfire bonnet with SilentCoat sound deadening on the underside, on another thread here. You might have seen it. I am not at my PC at the moment but if it is of any help, I will post it here tomorrow for you.

Pete, sorry, forgot to find and post this...

Its not my car, but one that I saw at a show and thought that I might pinch the idea if I ever got my steel bonnet refinished. My bonnet is STILL ongoing.

[Bfg]

May 5th :

I moved the weekend before last from one side of the car park to the other (..in the apartment block complex), primarily because the studio apartment was too small for all my unsorted 'stuff' and equally because I wanted needed a designated place to work on the car..  The new residence is a one-bed apartment but with patio large enough to land the car on. . .

^ Although south facing, the first job I did was to jet-wash the patio of most of its dingy green algae.  And then with the new low entry / high lift trolley jack ..and borrowed ramps - the car is now safely elevated enough for me to slide under and investigate various issues ..essentially regarding Katie's  very poor passenger-door-gap and how much chassis / car flex might I expect when jacking the car up.? 

These questions were prompted by my acquiring the Surrey top and back-light a couple of weeks ago, and then also a Surrey lid (in steel) ..thanks to the kind generosity of RogerH of the TR forum .. whom I had the great pleasure to meet when I collected it on Thursday. .

My thinking was ; It might be OK with a fabric Surrey top and adjustable bows, but with the windscreen posts moveable and the rear wings not necessarily being symmetrical on this car, then how would a steel lid fit.?  Naturally things have to be fixed to within a few mm.. but the passenger door gap tapers from 14mm opening at the top to 3mm in its bottom rear corner.   Bottom line is that I needed to investigate what, if anything was happening with the door gap. before I struggle to fit the backlight and lid.

I slipped under the jacked up car to have a look at the chassis when I bought her  ..just two months ago now, and then again when the car was jacked up briefly while removing / refitting the gearbox / clutch.  In general it appeared to have been locally patched but in good shape.  Before I jacked the car up this time I measured the top of the door gaps, then lifted the car under the rear swing arm and measured the door gap again.  I was pleasantly surprised that there was just 1.5mm difference on one side and 2mm on the other.  A kind gent dropped me a PM to share that his car was much the same.  

Pleased that the main backbone wasn't moving too much, and now with the car on stands I investigated further. The rear chassis leg on the LHS is cracked as is the rear bridge between the two rear chassis legs, onto which the dampers are bolted.  This also supports the rear diff mounts. . . 

     

^ LHS rear chassis leg (which goes to the rear bumper bracket).  This would not be difficult to clean up re-weld and to add a doubler plate.  It has been welded before but I don't know if that was from new or a repair.  The question I must ask is ; whether there is some issue to have caused it to crack (some time ago by the looks of things) or is it just the result of fatigue over many years ?

^ photo of across the car with the arrow left indicating where the crack is on the LHS.  Immediately above this is the bridge from one side of the chassis to the other, onto which the lever-arm dampers are bolted and the rear diff mounts.  That is also cracked on both sides. . .

^ LHS -  looking into the corner of the rear chassis leg with the bridge

^ LHS looking back to the bridge with the lever-arm damper in light grey. The crack appears to go right the way across.

On the RHS its probably worse . . .

RHS bottom of the rear leg has a little rusty orange stain, so looks to be just starting to crack in the same place as has happened on the LHS rear leg.  The crack between that chassis member and the bridge is obvious.

RHS looking forward to that bridge.   Again I wonder - why has it cracked through ?

So., all in all a bit of welding needed.  Whether it is necessary / much better to replace that bridge for a box section tubular one I don't know.  I don't want to lift the body off but I can't see getting above it to weld a replacement bridge in is going to be possible even if the exhaust + lever arm dampers + diff + possibly fuel tank (for safety reasons) are removed.  

Surely someone has experience of doing this with body on ? 

Out of interest I eased the LHS rear chassis leg up with the jack, just by the exhaust silencer cross-box, and although the chassis leg's crack hardly opened up (perhaps just 1/2mm) the top of that side's door gap closed by 4mm.   That x2 would be nice.!   However I'm naturally concerned about twisting the chassis rear legs and rear-end of the body so the car would look even lower still on the driver's side.

Why the car has a list to the RHS is not yet apparent.  I'm sure that I've read somewhere that the swinging arm brackets are adjustable and may even be fitted upside.  Possibly this is the same at for the front suspension.  Perhaps someone might point me to the thread which reveals all.?

In the meantime these are the photos I took today of those mountings. Perhaps someone can see something amiss which would cause the car to sit lower on the RHS  . . .

^ Looking forward, so Left and Right hand side

^ Left and Right hand side of the swing arm mounts. 

Many thanks in anticipation,

Pete

 

[Colin Lindsay]

2 hours ago, Bfg said:

In the meantime these are the photos I took today of those mountings. Perhaps someone can see something amiss which would cause the car to sit lower on the RHS  . . .

I've been looking at those two pics like one of those stereoscope thingies in the hope that something would leap out at me, but all it did was to give me a sore head... however I know it's only the angle of the photo but it seems I can see more of one spring than the other. That's where I'd start; swap the springs over and see if it changes the lower side, or if it makes any difference. 

[thescrapman]

Has the car had updated lever arms fitted?

does it look like there has always been additional weight carried in boot, a heavy tool box perhaps?

i suspect it is just fatigue over a long period, especially if chassis was deemed OK when it was rebuilt

Are you sorted for the welding?

I think a few patches may be the best bet for now, put some strength back in, but still removable when the body comes off next for a proper repair 

[Bfg]

8 hours ago, Mathew said:

A bit radical but to weld the other side of the crack you could support the chassis, cut out the front. Weld from the inside of the box. Then weld a new section in from the side you got in. If that makes sense. 

Thanks Mathew,   it did make sense ..the forth time i read it..

Cut out / remove one face of the box, in the damaged areas of the bridge, for access to weld inside. And then rebuild / replace the steel which I cut out.  Yes., that may work.

cheers.

I still wonder why these areas should be so extensively cracked.  If a lever arm had seized up then I would understand that side twisting and cracking, but both sides seems odd. 

[Bfg]

48 minutes ago, thescrapman said:

Has the car had updated lever arms fitted?

does it look like there has always been additional weight carried in boot, a heavy tool box perhaps?

i suspect it is just fatigue over a long period, especially if chassis was deemed OK when it was rebuilt

Are you sorted for the welding?

I think a few patches may be the best bet for now, put some strength back in, but still removable when the body comes off next for a proper repair 

I don't know if uprated lever arms have been fitted  ..good place to start though - thanks, I'll see if I can pull one off and/or otherwise identify it.  Hey just thinking about it, I wonder if the prior owner had filled them with heavy oil. 

I think rather than a heavy load in the boot, looking around it appears as if the rear of the car has been jacked up under the tubular cross beam, under the spare wheel well. 

From photo I've seen of other chassis I think this round tube would have been straight but for a local dip under the middle of the spare wheel well (light blue dotted line) and that has been push up to where it now is (solid darker blue line).   Such loading would lift the rear legs and in turn put those bottom plate welds in tension, which have then failed (red arrows to the left and right). 

I think this may account for the cracks in the bottom plate of those rear chassis legs but not in the cross bridge.  However, and just thinking out loud as I type.. with the rear legs cracked.. the tail of the car might be bouncing up and down with every road bump ..and the focus of that flexing (the cracked chassis legs) just happens to be where the bridge is welded on. so the flexing of the back of the car might have been limited by those thin plates of the bridge, which in turn have failed. 

"fatigue over a long period" caused by the chassis legs having been broken ..by lifting the car by its rear legs rather than under the suspension arms.

Thank you., your prompts have started the train of thoughts which are beginning to make sense

 

Welding. no I'm not yet sorted.  I was given the number of a Mr Barry Atkins who is (or was, as he may have retired now) a mobile welder in this area, but I tried yesterday to call but it seems as if that number cannot now be connected.  The VW chaps in Jamie's barn was likely to be my next call, but I'd welcome suggestions.

Thanks, Pete.

 

 

 

  

[Pete Lewis]

dont know about the trailing arm evolutions over the years but  brackets to change camber on 2000/stag are available from chris witor 

Pete 

[Bfg]

Work In progress. .

^ as was, albeit cleaned up quite a bit of rusty water stains and I had also replaced the fan for that off a TR6.  The card radiator ducting's back edge was falling apart and unfastened / just dangling a third of the way down the radiator ..so its uneven edge was poking into and chafing against the radiator core.  Subsequently, it was a sod to get out ..because the radiator's bottom hose connection and drain tap wouldn't lift out passed the fan.  And then also because the screws holding the ducting across the front were cross-head set-screws without the room to get a screwdriver in below the bonnet ..and with no access to get a spanner onto the loose-turning nuts they screwed into.  Even when unfastened it didn't want to come out of the gap between the radiator and inner wheel-arch ..not helped by the wires being taped to the grille stays.  In the end though it did succumb to my efforts. although then ..as a frisby, it likewise failed miserably to fly far down the garden !

^ the radiator was removed for easier access to replace ; the engine mounts + the steering rack brackets + the water pipes + fan belt +radiator mounting rubbers.  I also removed the fan to check the fan-extension's bolt was tight (my torque wrench only goes up to 110ft-lb ..and as it happens it was tight, but I think still worth checking - Thanks Mickey on the TR forum).  With the radiator & ducting out of the way, the car's was previously painted colour (more crimson) was apparent.   Above shows after I cleaned out more of the rusty radiator water stains.  

^ tidying up is always encouraging.   At a later date I'll also clean, check connections and re-route the wiring. 

^ reassembly in progress..  I'm getting the car back together for now, as I clearly have more major issues to focus on.

Pete.

[Bfg]

The radiator is sprouting cardboard wings ! ?   ..but not of the duck / duct variety

^ close enough for the car industry ?

 

^ The theory is that ; at higher speeds, the angle of a conic shape of radiator ducting results in back pressure, which lessens the amount of air coming in through the front grille.  Whereas the very much larger volume behind the grille allows the air in which then tends to swirl around and back towards the radiator. 

Don't know if in fact it makes much difference at all.  Personally I disliked the original cardboard ducting, or its fit,  or its chafing away at the radiator core,  and I disliked even more trying to get the ducting out so that the radiator might then be carefully removed.  The side baffles I've made ought to be much easier in that respect and I think, once finished with a splash of colour (or black) and edge trimming.. will look neater too. 

^ I know.,  blow the expense ..1/8" plywood  (..yeah Ok.,  I reclaimed from the skip) 

^ I'm pleased with how it shaped up OK with just a few hours 'work'.   I'll find some edge trim for around the grille aperture and, very likely, I'll cut a hole in the RHS panel to duct fresh air to the carburettors.

Across the top / under the bonnet I'm leaving a gap to allow fresh air flow to spill over the top of the dam. The tendency then will be for that air to pass by the engine as it exits under the car. 

Pete