What's this?

[Roger89]

I've started changing the rear diff input shaft on my 1500 spitfire to a unit I got from The spitfire graveyard shop on eBay I took the old shaft out and found this tiny bit of broken copper sat on the bearing anybody know what is? 

I was thinking of replacing the sump plug with a magnetic sump plug anybody know where I can get one from

[Badwolf]

I don't know about the bit of copper but make sure you get the correct sump plug (search on ths forum) as there are a least 2 different types. I got the wrong one and only found out after dropping the oil and trying to put the wrong new plug in. Some have a square end and tapered thread the other that I have has a hex head, parallel threads and a copper washer. They (as I now know) are not compatible. I had to put the old knackered one back in 'til the next oil change!

[Pete Lewis]

the only coppery stuff in the diff is the  differential gear thrust washers  behind the sun and planet gears 

doesnt look like part of one of those , more some foreign body left inside  and its been knarled by tooth contact

 

magnetics are 155660   and seems shown every where a std 114774 is used 

Pete

 

[Paul H]

1 hour ago, Roger89 said:

I've started changing the rear diff input shaft on my 1500 spitfire to a unit I got from The spitfire graveyard shop on eBay I took the old shaft out and found this tiny bit of broken copper sat on the bearing anybody know what is? 

I was thinking of replacing the sump plug with a magnetic sump plug anybody know where I can get one from

Canleys sell the magnetic plug https://www.canleyclassics.com/demoapp/?ptno=155660

Paul

[Badwolf]

Ahh yes 155660... the wrong one. Then I remember my engjne is a Herald 13/60... but it still won't fit!!

[Colin Lindsay]

Two things here - I know it's early morning and the coffee isn't working... but - changing the sump plug won't fish things out of your diff and secondly, if that's copper, it won't be magnetic...

However this is a shorter version:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ferrari-360-Modena-Spider-Challenge-Magnetic-Sump-Plug-Neodymium-magnet/202657588889?fits=Car+Make%3ATriumph|Model%3ASpitfire|Cars+Type%3A1500|Cars+Year%3A1980|Plat_Gen%3A--|Variant%3A--+[1962-1980]+Convertible&epid=5017012088&hash=item2f2f556699:g:HqcAAOSwBLlU-DNg

[Pete Lewis]

that says its 22m x 1.25    its metric  !!!

 

triumphs are 3/8ntp  x18 tpi    

 

Pete

[daverclasper]

Canley etc, used to do them, for about £7, I think.

Dave

[Colin Lindsay]

2 hours ago, Pete Lewis said:

that says its 22m x 1.25    its metric  !!!

triumphs are 3/8ntp  x18 tpi    

Pete

The sneaky ********

I ran a compatibility check and that one came up. I'll have to contact them now to make them aware.

 

[Pete Lewis]

Not done any homework on this  ,  You could compare the two threads and pitch maybe theres some close likeness  ???

Pete

 

[Peter Truman]

Ref foreign part Pete suggested the copper planet gear thrust washer, well here's what came out of my Vitesse Mk2 when I did an overhaul, I would suggest it broke and turned out very early in the cars life as there was no apparent noise or slackness from the diff, but the rotaflex would have possibly covered a lot of ills.

Note it was flattened out from the spherical shape as it turned out of its fitted place, I replaced it with an Aussie Holden similar part when reassembled.

The hole is what I used to put on my spare set of car keys keyring just so I didn't loose it!

Peter T

[RogerH]

Seeing the squished copper thingy reminded me of my train spotting days in the late 50's. (not the 80's - that was something different_)

During slack periods (that is lack of engines to spot) we would put 1d (penny) coins on the track.

When the next train went over it would flatten and stretch the penny. 

We had one penny that was nearly a yard long (that was in the days when Wagon Wheel biscuits were the size of real wagon wheels.

 

Roger. 

[Pete Lewis]

happy days  

Pete

[poppyman]

That is making me feel seriously old now.

Tony. 

[Chris A]

33 minutes ago, poppyman said:

That is making me feel seriously old now.

Tony. 

Ditto. Can't the administrator declare this type of content inappropriate and a risk to our mental health? 😱

[JohnD]

Oh, come on!   70 in the body, 17 in the head!

JOhn

[Chris A]

3 hours ago, JohnD said:

Oh, come on!   70 in the body, 17 in the head!

JOhn

70 in the body for someone who is (only) 66, 17 in the head isn't the best IQ to have. Second glass of Irish is needed and damn the colesterol. 🙅

 

[Pete Lewis]

Yee haaaa !!!!

[Roger89]

Yes stripped the diff apart now. Loads more if the copper pieces plus the oil was like grinding paste. Planet gears definitely moving so I think it is the thrust washer Peter suggested above. Think I'm going to send both units off for recon now as just spent oner £300 on replacing every bush, bolt nut plus shocks etc on everything we took off the back end. Seemed a shame to have it stripped down so far and put back in 40 yr old parts.

1 question though, I noticed it's recommended to mark position of prop to diff but I haven't as I thought I was changing the unit.

I'm going to put my head on a rail track if this keeps up, lol.

[Pete Lewis]

in real terms marking the prop and flange orientation only works if there is a runout problem with either the prop  or coupling flanges  they locate in a flat faced register with about a max 0.005" spigot runout tolerance , on the assy line its thrown on and works the register makes it concentric the bolts just clamp the faces to take the drive 

any bruising or distortion of the coupling faces cause the vibration not the design  it should not matter which way you fit  it,

if theres a good or bad position its the face or spigot has a problem you cant see .

never paint the faces  they must GRIP .

Pete

[Roger89]

Thanks Pete, so tempted to put the diff on we got from scrap yard just as a temp measure so we can move the car about. Only while we wait for the original diff to be reconed. I'm presuming it must have run without that thrust washer but do you think it'll do further damage to the diff if I installed it. I've washed out all the gritty old  oil and re oiled it so it's nice and clean in there. Just wouldn't like to be driving and the diff exploded!

[Pete Lewis]

the diff gears only turn slowly unless your wheel spinning on ice one side,  free play is often quite a bit and has no effect on the crown wheel and pinion mesh or wear, if the diff was quite driving i would just   replace the thrust washers and re use it 

1/8 to 1/4 turn of the prop coupling as 'diff gear'  backlash is not uncommon by design  not the few thou of crownwheel backlash being a very different kettle of fish

excess diff gear ( being sun and planets)  backlash  has no problems but can give a klunk on overun or going for reverse

it aint going to explode .

the diff has two separate functions ,, the drive from Crown wheel and pinion mesh, and the differential which apportions drive to the easiest wheel to turn 

allows each wheel to turn at different speeds and still transmit crownwheel power to the wheels  like  on  a roundabout 

Pete

 

[Roger89]

Thanks Pete, so tempted to put the diff on we got from scrap yard just as a temp measure so we can move the car about. Only while we wait for the original diff to be reconed. I'm presuming it must have run without that thrust washer but do you think it'll do further damage to the diff if I installed it. I've washed out all the gritty old  oil and re oiled it so it's nice and clean in there. Just wouldn't like to be driving and the diff exploded!

[Roger89]

Thanks Pete, so tempted to put the diff on we got from scrap yard just as a temp measure so we can move the car about. Only while we wait for the original diff to be reconed. I'm presuming it must have run without that thrust washer but do you think it'll do further damage to the diff if I installed it. I've washed out all the gritty old  oil and re oiled it so it's nice and clean in there. Just wouldn't like to be driving and the diff exploded!

[Roger89]

So the really nice guy from the spitfire scrap yard shop on eBay from Sheffield has offered to exchanged the diff he sent me for another one. But I'm not sure whether I'm still going to get the same problem. A really nice bloke called Mike papworth was recommended to me and he has offered to take both these diffs and make one good one for me so I'm going to go with this option. I've just ordered a whole set of every single bush and bolt for the back end, over £300 from Rimmer s as I want the job done properly and it seems a shame to put old stuff back on whilst it's this far stripped down. having a real serious issue getting the rear trunnion bolts out as they are seized in pretty solid any ideas be appreciated ASI don't want to bend the frame!