Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, Paul H said: Just starting to loosen the W714/2 filter . Is it in right place or above the PRV valve . This is the same position it’s been in since I first fitted it nearly 4 years ago . Paul Here’s a brighter pic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpitFire6 Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Good quality picture. I had to zoom in to see the PRV "nut". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 You can see the PRV straight above it in the photo, half hidden by the filter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Just now, Colin Lindsay said: You can see the PRV straight above it in the photo, half hidden by the filter. Sorry didn’t make myself clear . Is the filter in the correct position or angle with the PRV below the filter or should the filter be positioned below the PRV Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppyman Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 It does not matter Paul, mine is at the same angle. Tony. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 1 minute ago, poppyman said: It does not matter Paul, mine is at the same angle. Tony. That’s good enough for me . I’ll carry on Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Yes, the angle of filter doesn't matter; although even with all sorts of non-return valves they do all drain back eventually, even if it does take a week or so. I was searching for a good photo - which I couldn't find - but did manage to find a diagram of how the PRV works. I think even with it fully open it won't normally take all of the oil, unless the filter is completely stopping the flow and forcing it through the PRV since there's nowhere else for it to go. A combination of blocked or unsuitable filter and weak PRV spring? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpitFire6 Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Colin Lindsay said: Yes, the angle of filter doesn't matter; although even with all sorts of non-return valves they do all drain back eventually, even if it does take a week or so. I was searching for a good photo - which I couldn't find - but did manage to find a diagram of how the PRV works. I think even with it fully open it won't normally take all of the oil, unless the filter is completely stopping the flow and forcing it through the PRV since there's nowhere else for it to go. A combination of blocked or unsuitable filter and weak PRV spring? This picture shows oil dumping to the sump. Previously it was decided that this is incorrect for a six? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Just did 2 x 10 sec runs with filter loose and nothing no oil coming out of the filter housing Do I take the filter off completely and check again I’ve not checked the PRV yet Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 15 minutes ago, SpitFire6 said: This picture shows oil dumping to the sump. Previously it was decided that this is incorrect for a six? It's a generic illustration courtesy of FRAM - don't expect it to match a Triumph engine. 18 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said: I think even with it fully open it won't normally take all of the oil, unless the filter is completely stopping the flow and forcing it through the PRV since there's nowhere else for it to go. A combination of blocked or unsuitable filter and weak PRV spring? It depends on the oil, the pump, the engine speed, etc. If the oil is thin, the pump is weak and the engine is idling, a fully open PRV will vent all of the oil that comes its way. But hopefully the PRV isn't fully open! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, Paul H said: Just did 2 x 10 sec runs with filter loose and nothing no oil coming out of the filter housing Do I take the filter off completely and check again I’ve not checked the PRV yet I wouldn't run it with the filter completely removed but perhaps... double check the sump fill level, check the PRV, plugs out and crank for a minute. If you still don't get oil through to the filter then you're going to have to start dismantling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 26 minutes ago, SpitFire6 said: This picture shows oil dumping to the sump. Previously it was decided that this is incorrect for a six? Yes, it was just to give Paul an idea of what we meant and how it worked. It's one of those annoying situations where I really want to hop on a plane, go to Paul's house, look at the engine and work it out when it's in front of me, otherwise it's just hypothesis and really frustrating! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 PRV is out and looks ok to me , surface wear in pic 2 Should I now reassemble PRV and filter , remove plugs and turnover for 60 secs ? Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppyman Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 17 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said: Yes, it was just to give Paul an idea of what we meant and how it worked. It's one of those annoying situations where I really want to hop on a plane, go to Paul's house, look at the engine and work it out when it's in front of me, otherwise it's just hypothesis and really frustrating! I'm with you on that one Colin. Tony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Paul I take it the prv seat inside the block looks ok and you can feel the spring being compressed as you screw it in? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 I think even just a poorly sealing prv could allow air to be fed back to the pump inlet so that it struggles to prime itself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 If it all looks good I would reassemble everything as you say and give it a spin with out plugs. There's oil film still in the bearings so no problem with turning them without load👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 When I screw back the PRV there is little or no spring pressure . I have a spare mk2 engine I’ll check that one and see if it’s the same Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpitFire6 Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Me: If there is no oil flowing I would worry about damaging bearings or rocker shaft. Disconnect battery. Take dizzy cap off and photo rotor position Take dizzy off (two nuts) and photo position of gear drive. Take out gear drive by rotating it. Use a cordless drill on reverse with a long "deal" to engage in the oil pump drive slot. Hold tight a spin pump CCW. If no oil you will have to drop sump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Can't remember now what the prv seat is like. Does the plunger just fit in a hole so the spring isn't compressed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpitFire6 Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 The plunger seals the hole it presses against. Oil pressure should push it off the seat against the spring pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 1 minute ago, johny said: Can't remember now what the prv seat is like. Does the plunger just fit in a hole so the spring isn't compressed? Plunger fits in the recess and spring loaded though very little tension on spring Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpitFire6 Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Spring is 38mm long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted June 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Second PRV is exactly the same with wear in same place . Spring is 38mm . PRV goes back in place on both engines without the need of socket Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 Think we can discount a prv problem then. Looks like your choices are now to vent or not and to spin on starter or drill... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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