Nick Jones Posted July 3, 2020 Report Share Posted July 3, 2020 Good advice already given. Using the brake adjusters to lock the wheel is a nice one. Re-use of bolts may depend on how hard they fight and what is left of them........ but ok to re-use if undamaged. I have had two or three people tell me that they've changed rotos without taking the link off the car or disturbing the wheel bearing - but frankly I have no idea how. I did have a bit of a go on one occasion and while the old one came off without much grief, that was only because it was already falling apart and just broke when stretched. I didn't feel that was any possibility of stretching the new one enough to get it over the tripod without doing damage - even if I'd been strong enough. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted July 3, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2020 Okay I've got my wire brush and penetrating oil at the ready. I'll need to build up the front calipers and fill with fluid before I can lock the wheels so I've got a few days to give the bolts a good soak. Not sure I'm going to chance fitting without removing the driveshaft, doesn't sound like something for a first timer! Hopefully the bolts come out okay. They are surprisingly expensive (£30ish a side I recall), I guess they are high tensile and in a fairly unique size/thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trigolf Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 Richard, I think James Paddock, Canleys or Rimmer's still sell the bolts. Do not cut the compression band off the coupling until all the bolts are fitted, otherwise you'll really struggle to get the holes lined up.The bolts are a unique style, as they have a plain non-threaded end to the bolt. I've always managed to loosen the bolts with the shaft on the garage floor and jamming a tyre lever or pry bar through the spiders of the shaft and getting my mate to stand on the tyre lever, whilst I loosen the bolt. If the bolts are really shagged - I've probably got enough good ones lying about you could have. PM sent to you. Gav Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted July 4, 2020 Report Share Posted July 4, 2020 47 minutes ago, trigolf said: Richard, I think James Paddock, Canleys or Rimmer's still sell the bolts. Do not cut the compression band off the coupling until all the bolts are fitted, otherwise you'll really struggle to get the holes lined up.The bolts are a unique style, as they have a plain non-threaded end to the bolt. I've always managed to loosen the bolts with the shaft on the garage floor and jamming a tyre lever or pry bar through the spiders of the shaft and getting my mate to stand on the tyre lever, whilst I loosen the bolt. If the bolts are really shagged - I've probably got enough good ones lying about you could have. PM sent to you. Gav I bought my rotoflexes and bolts from Canleys Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted July 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 Thanks Gav/Paul. Just waiting on a 1/4in square drive spanner for the rear brake adjusters. They are rather tight and I don't want to knock the edges off with an unsuitable shifter. A few tugs on the rotoflex bolts with someone pressing the brake suggested they are indeed rather tight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 Plenty of decent penetrating oil will usually save the adjusters. It’s worth stripping them completely for a full clean and reassembly with high temperature grease. They work so much better when free-turning and you can feel the flats. Roto bolts can be very stubborn. Make sure you’ve had your 3 shredded wheat and keep a can of spinach handy..... Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted July 10, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2020 Quick query, when relieving the load on the lead spring how do you know you have gone far enough? Using a bottle jack, and the spring lifter tool I've got the point where the tool is against the bump stop, at this point I can slide the shock off it's mountings. However, I can't tell if there is no load on the spring - if there is load when I knock the spring eye bolt out its going to go with a bang - I'd rather that didn't happen!! Am I missing something? The haynes has a second jack under the vertical link in the diagram that it doesn't mention in the text. With the spring lifter taking the weight of the spring and the second jack taking the weight of the vertical link I assume the spring eye bolt will just slide out. I guess also once the shock is off and the spring eye bolt removed I can lower the spring lifter tool and breath again. Maybe I'm over thinking this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted July 10, 2020 Report Share Posted July 10, 2020 If the spring lifter is supporting the spring then it won't drop. If another jack is supporting the vertical link then that won't drop either. If you knock the bolt out in this condition, neither of the things it attaches are being supported by the bolt so its removal won't cause anything to "go with a bang". This is, of course, only taking one dimension into account. The bolt will be awkward to remove because the rotoflex is under tension, meaning that the vertical link wants to move outward. But it can't move far so that's not a big problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted July 10, 2020 Report Share Posted July 10, 2020 As Rob says..... Getting that bolt out is easy. Putting it back in with a fresh roto......... 😳 that’ll test your patience 🙄 May the force be with you..... Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted July 10, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2020 57 minutes ago, NonMember said: If the spring lifter is supporting the spring then it won't drop. If another jack is supporting the vertical link then that won't drop either. If you knock the bolt out in this condition, neither of the things it attaches are being supported by the bolt so its removal won't cause anything to "go with a bang". This is, of course, only taking one dimension into account. The bolt will be awkward to remove because the rotoflex is under tension, meaning that the vertical link wants to move outward. But it can't move far so that's not a big problem. Thanks, it was the second jack that was the missing link. Going to need to source a taller axle stand to hold the lifter. 52 minutes ago, Nick Jones said: As Rob says..... Getting that bolt out is easy. Putting it back in with a fresh roto......... 😳 that’ll test your patience 🙄 May the force be with you..... Nick That sounds fun...tapered dowl and patience to hand then! Once the whishbone is attached to chassis and driveshaft flange loosley bolted up I assume its a case of riving on it until that bolt is back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 When I did my GT6 way back in the '90s, I enlisted the help of a neighbour - a lorry driver - to push the hub inward while I lined up the tapered dowel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 Yeah...... it’s the fact that you have to significantly distort the Roto to allow the top of the vertical link to move in enough for the bolt to line up. And the Roto resists..... I have been known to use ratchet straps. But now I have CVs, so that fight has gone away! Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 I changed the Rotoflexes, ujs, wheel bearings on my Vitesse approx 3 years ago on my own and it was the most difficult time consuming job . I could do it today much quicker using the followings tips when reassembling Jack up the spring lifter with a trolley until it starts to lift the car , drop down a fraction , I did have to use wooden blocks for the jack Assemble all links leaving the top vertical link bolt till last Use a scissor jack under the vertical link to line up ( easier said than done ) . To assist the lining up I cut a 24 ins wrecking bar ( Toolstation ) leaving a 6 ins point . Any more and you wouldn’t get access. Tap / hammer in the point to assist lining up Using a mirror on the other side you can gauge whether the top bolt will go in and drive out the pointed bar. This worked on one side though did use a screwdriver to assist lining up , the other side refused to line up.The scissor jack will be constantly changed with the levelling process For the obstinate side I used a longer bolt which I ground to a point which worked . I then sawed it in place and filed the leading edge and added the nut. Not quite as per the workshop manual but needs must Paul 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted July 12, 2020 Report Share Posted July 12, 2020 Sounds familiar....... The tool in the top pic is called a podger. The Americans call the aligning bars..... but where is the fun in that. The final tool development for me was an old spring eye bolt with the head cut off and the other end ground to a blunt point at a shallow angle - a podger as above - but a podger that you can tap all the way in and then chase through with the actual bolt. Works like a charm 🙂 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted September 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2020 I'm on with the roto change after a little hiatus for summer holidays/other priorities. Any tips on getting the new rotoflex over the flange on the outer half shaft? I've still got the metal bands on (and intend to keep them on!) but I can't see how they are going to go over given the relative sizes! Thanks, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted September 15, 2020 Report Share Posted September 15, 2020 I thought the technique was to strip the shaft so that it doesn't have a flange, then reassemble once the rotoflex is on. My WSM isn't to hand at the moment and it's a long time since I did the job. I remember it being a pig to dismantle the hub and get the bearings off the shaft but I don't remember having trouble getting the rotoflex into place once I'd done so. (I did have to buy one new outer shaft as the legs on the old one were bent!) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted September 15, 2020 Report Share Posted September 15, 2020 I wouldn't advocate it and others will probably poobah it but I replaced both on my Vitesse rotaflex's around 10 years ago without dismantling the outer shaft, by cutting the band off the rotaflex and prising the coupling over the outer drive shaft tri finger flange then recompress the rotaflex with a DIY two part hexagon band/clamp I made so I could get the bolts back into the two drive flanges. The 2 piece band I made was crude and made out of scrap strip steel using the compressed rotaflex band as an example, I still have it in case! Maybe I was lucky as I didn't damage the rotaflex but it's still all OK. Hopefully others will respond to this DIY method with the pro's, con's, and risks of damage! A quick check in the garage and I couldn't locate the offending DIY clamp, but its there and if I can locate it I'll post a photo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted September 16, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2020 8 hours ago, NonMember said: I thought the technique was to strip the shaft so that it doesn't have a flange, then reassemble once the rotoflex is on. My WSM isn't to hand at the moment and it's a long time since I did the job. I remember it being a pig to dismantle the hub and get the bearings off the shaft but I don't remember having trouble getting the rotoflex into place once I'd done so. (I did have to buy one new outer shaft as the legs on the old one were bent!) I'm glad you mentioned that. On closer inspection I see I have not removed the stoneguard or spacer from the half shaft! Just need to work out how that might be removed without the special Churchill tool. Some exploratory taps with a copper hammer yielded little so I might have to manufacture some sort of puller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted September 16, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2020 7 hours ago, Peter Truman said: I wouldn't advocate it and others will probably poobah it but I replaced both on my Vitesse rotaflex's around 10 years ago without dismantling the outer shaft, by cutting the band off the rotaflex and prising the coupling over the outer drive shaft tri finger flange then recompress the rotaflex with a DIY two part hexagon band/clamp I made so I could get the bolts back into the two drive flanges. The 2 piece band I made was crude and made out of scrap strip steel using the compressed rotaflex band as an example, I still have it in case! Maybe I was lucky as I didn't damage the rotaflex but it's still all OK. Hopefully others will respond to this DIY method with the pro's, con's, and risks of damage! A quick check in the garage and I couldn't locate the offending DIY clamp, but its there and if I can locate it I'll post a photo. Thanks Peter, good to know this is also a potential way forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted September 16, 2020 Report Share Posted September 16, 2020 People used to use jubilee clips, 2, joined together to recompress the rotoflex after levering it over the 3 "prongs". But teh "correct" way is indeed pull the hub, dismantle the shaft and fit the rotoflex without cutting the band. The sensible approach now, given the extraordinary cost of decent quality rotoflex's is to pay a little more and fit CV's. But if mileage is limited and ownership is not expected to be long, the cheap rotoflexs should last a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted September 16, 2020 Report Share Posted September 16, 2020 Im with Clive on Imps we always used a long or pair of jubilee clips maybe the better band clamps work better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 Ingie UK, I found my DIY Rotaflex crude clamp/compressor so here's a photo of it used to recompress the rota after cutting the band and prising the new unit over the tri finger flange, worked well and permitted the lining up of the 6 bolts 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingieuk Posted September 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 Thanks Clive, Peter and Pete all good information! After a few cold wet (and now dark) evenings work I have both sides renewed. Unfortunately with the spring lifter in play the car has had to live outside on account of my garage not being wide enough. I did need some ratchet straps to get that spring eye bolt in though! Anyway they were all fitted until I decided it would be worth doing the output shaft and pinion oil seals so it's all come off again! Thanks all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted December 14, 2020 Report Share Posted December 14, 2020 Just to revive an old thread, there's a pair of GM couplings quite cheap on eBay at present: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/triumph-herald-vitesse-car-parts/124482409827?hash=item1cfbbad563:g:Z9oAAOSw6K1f04N- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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