johny Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 7 minutes ago, thescrapman said: Spitfire went to J-type with very last Mk4, I have a Couple of them. TR6 went J-type with the CR cars, so 73. Same with Big Saloons, about 73 I think. My 2 1850 3-rails boxes are WE ones, well one was, it has recently been rebuilt into a spare casing, so is now in a GR overstamped one, which show signs of being a WE before interestingly. Did either of the WE boxes have OD and which type was it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 the other clues i think ?? all dolly were a 20 rolled spline input shaft the VIT/ GT6 vintage would be a 10 cut spline input shaft roger whats yours got ?? Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger K Posted January 31, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 10, Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 so not dolly related as i see it .....not that thats good if you use it dont forget to seal with sealer and coper washer on the bottom clutch hsg bolt i would ignore the serial and go for its a bog std 6 cly 3 rail + D type as used by triumf complete with historic corrosion and oily bits Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 34 minutes ago, Pete Lewis said: the other clues i think ?? all dolly were a 20 rolled spline input shaft the VIT/ GT6 vintage would be a 10 cut spline input shaft Not all Pete. Dolomite ( as in original from early 70's before they put engine sizes on the badge) were 10-spline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 yes the rolled fine spline was definitely only the single rail boxes as used in later 1850 and other cars.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 6 hours ago, Pete Lewis said: as WE doesnt exist on any base triumph data The Leyland WSM for the 1850 Dolomite lists WE as the prefix for a 3-rail gearbox, WH for single rail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted January 31, 2021 Report Share Posted January 31, 2021 But that leaves the WM serial numbers which are listed in quite few places as 1850 units - maybe the autos😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted February 1, 2021 Report Share Posted February 1, 2021 theres lots of data with no WE like this chart , but if Robs got WE in a genuine WSM that solves it apart from would a dolly be D type or J types ???? did the input shaft length cjhange 6 cyl to 1850 ws it just the B hsg, that made the match ?? http://www.wolfitt.com/numbers_and_ratios.htm Factory identification numbers Spitfire - Herald - Vitesse - GT6 Model Comm No Engine Gearbox Diff Ratio Herald 948 G G G G 4.875 948 TC Saloon GY Y G Y 4.55 948 Coupe/Conv Y Y G Y 4.55 1200 GA GA/GD GB GA 4.11 1200 Export GB GB/GD GB GA 4.11 13/60 GE GE/GK GB GE 4.11 Vitesse '6' HB HB HB HB 4.11 2 Litre MkI HC HC HC FD 3.89 2 Liter MkII HC50001 on HC50001 on HC HC 3.89 GT6 MkI KC KC KC KC 3.27 MkII KC50001 on KC50001 on KC KC 3.27 GT6+ USA KD50001 on KD50001 on KD KC 3.27 KD 3.89 MkIII KE KE KE KC 3.27 KD 3.89 MkIII USA KF KF KF KC 3.27 KD 3.89 Spitfire '4' (Mk I) FC FC FC FC 4.11 '4' (MkII) FC50001 on FC50001 on FC FC 4.11 MkIII FD FD FD FC 4.11 MkIII USA FDU FE FD FC 4.11 MkIV FH FH FH FH 3.89 MkIV 1300 USA FK FK FK FK 4.11 MkIV 1500 USA FK FM FK FH 3.89 MkIV Sweden FL FL FH FH 3.89 1500 FH750001 on FM FR FR 3.63 1500 USA FM FM FT FH 3.89 Other useful numbers Model Engine Gearbox 1300/TC RD/RF 1500 FWD WB/YB 1500 RWD YC YC/YD Toledo/Dolomite 1300 DG/DH DG/DN Toledo/Dolomite 1500 DM/DS/YC DG/DN/DR/YD Toledo/Dolomite 1850 WH/WM 2000 MkI MB 2000 MkII ME/ML 2.5 TC & PI CR/MG/MM/MN Return to main page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 1, 2021 Report Share Posted February 1, 2021 ahhhh thats the question, all Dollys were supposed to have J type but Rogers WE box has got a D type.... The same clutch was used on the 1850 as the 6 cylinders (ok the friction plate for the later single rails had to have more splines) so the input shafts are the same length and the bell housings very similar except the starter motor bulge is on the other side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted February 1, 2021 Report Share Posted February 1, 2021 Indeed, just the bellhousing. The dolly 3 rail box was popular swap into GT6's as it was te exact same length as a GT6 d type. It uses a shorter adapter plate between the box and OD than the other OD boxes (except the late mkIV spitfire box which is a 3 rail j type). However, IIRC ist still uses the weaker internals shared with the GT6, importantly the small mainshaft tip. And yes, just a bellhousing swap is required. Re Rogers WE box, I still think it is likely a case that was next on the bench and had the GT6 type internals fitted along with the D type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daverclasper Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 That factory ID, Pete's put up. I always thought Mk1 and 2 GT6 had 3:89 diffs, not 3:27?. Also just out out interest, Mk1 and 2 Vitesse, has same diff ratio's, though different no's. Were the diffs different as such?. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 According to my WSM as standard all GT6 had 3.89 for cars fitted with OD and 3.27 if not. And always assumed the FD, KD and HC diffs are all exactly the same but maybe an expert can tells us otherwise👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 Well, that chart confirms my WH box as Dolomite 1850 with J-type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 Yes thats 3 rail rather than the single rail which would be WM I believe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 55 minutes ago, johny said: According to my WSM as standard all GT6 had 3.89 for cars fitted with OD and 3.27 if not. And always assumed the FD, KD and HC diffs are all exactly the same but maybe an expert can tells us otherwise👍 Some markets got GT6?with 3.27 and OD, Swiss cars?? FD Has square input flange, and output flanges, and maybe small output shafts early on? Would need to check the shafts bit in parts manual Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 Are you sure about the FD diff as thats what my Mk1 Vit has got and it definitely has a round flange. According to the John Kippings email theyre all the same except that from 1971 the front case changed with a different carrier and bearings used... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger K Posted February 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 My last late MkIII GT6 (post KE20000) was an overdrive car and had a 3.27 diff. It was only 6 yrs old when I bought it from the original owner, and had not been modified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 Yes I think it could be asked for as an alternative to standard.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger K Posted February 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 I think with the run-out cars they just stuck that ratio in all of them, actually. Sure I read that somewhere... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 oh Ive got to check what type of OD is fitted to a very late GT6 (N reg) I know of so I'll look at the diff ratio at the same time👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger K Posted February 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 N reg?? Boy, they took a while to shift that one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 Yes they werent very popular at the end and although its a youngster you should see the rust in it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger K Posted February 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 Pretty sure they were using cheap Russian steel by then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted February 3, 2021 Report Share Posted February 3, 2021 2 hours ago, johny said: Are you sure about the FD diff as thats what my Mk1 Vit has got and it definitely has a round flange. The flange has probably been changed when the diff was changed. My GT6 used to have a GE diff (and yes, it was a 4.11 ratio) with round input flange and large output flanges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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