The best GT6 Ignition Distributor solution ?

[avivalasvegas]

After checking the previous owners note, it appears I have the Lucas with "red" rotor arm equipped. Interestingly, there is a later note that states that Magnetronic ignition and magnetronic coil with ballast resistor installed in 2010. This was recently "unseized" by Dale after being set to max advance somehow.

The 123 sounds like the better option in that the work is front loaded. I believe this is the specific recommended unit?

If I haven't missed anything, now I'll need to send the tachometer off for conversion and find someone with experience tuning this on a rolling road. Any suggestions?

[Nick Jones]

If going for the 123, get the 123-Tune so you can actually adjust the curve.

You will need and electronic tacho conversion.

Rolling road is the right way for the very best results. You can get most of the way there on the road but don’t put any more timing in than standard in the full load row, especially 3k rpm plus.

Equally you’ll likely see a worthy improvement from getting the Lucas properly rebuilt.

Nick

[Mjit]

Crank-triggered, full mappable ignition will be the best option - though also the most effort and cost.  It takes all the wear and inherent inaccuracy of the distributor out of the equation and makes an amazing difference to your car - to the point John at JY Classics thought I'd swapped the engine in my Spitfire 1300->1500 the first time he drove it post swap.  You can keep the mechanical tacho too if you want, just having the old dizzy sat there doing nothing more than turning the cable.

123, especially mappable is next best/next most expensive.  Much easier to fit than MegaJolt, etc but less accurate than those systems.

Next up are the more expensive systems like Lumenition Optronic, where you counter a lot of distributor wear but are still stuck with mechanical control over the advance, which even at its best is "about right".  Given the price of these I'd probably splash the extra bit of cash on a 123.

End of the line are the range of 'points replacement' systems, which basically swap seemingly constantly adjusting the points for replacing them when the die.  Some complain they don't last very long - but if we say they are £20 that's probably 6 you can buy for the cost of a Lumenition/10 for a 123/20 for a Trigger-Wheels.com Triumph kit...

[Colin Lindsay]

1 hour ago, Mjit said:

End of the line are the range of 'points replacement' systems, which basically swap seemingly constantly adjusting the points for replacing them when the die.  

You must have had a bad one. Mine are coming up on over ten years and still going strong.

[avivalasvegas]

I'm sold on the 123. Assuming I get one, my next challenge would be finding a specialist skilled and experience with tuning on a Rolling Road. Any suggestions?

[Iain T]

As your in London try Atspeed at Rayleigh Essex. 

http://www.atspeedracing.co.uk/

[iainbja]

I have a Powerspark one from E bay it has the drive for the Tacho although its actually on a 1500 engine now. Works really well car starts easily and idles smoothly was only about £60 or so I think  

[haggis]

I’ve just fitted the 123 programmable on my Gt6 mk1, had a long term problem with my lumenition unit, and a very worn distributor, couldn’t find a single curve (there were so many to compare) to put directly in, asked on here, searched the internet, eventually I got 123 to install a curve based on the Lucas number, it was rubbish and didn’t work, but I have tweaked it myself and she runs sweeter than ever, these are my curves, not been to a rolling road yet, but planning to do so in the future. Had no idea on the MAP, so went with 123 pre-programmed. 

I think the cost for the 123, the tacho conversion and rolling road will be more than I expected, but I did cure my problem. I now have an immobiliser and a very steady tacho and I lost a tacho cable from my crowded bulk head. 

if by any chance someone does have the 123 curves for a 2000cc post rolling road please show so I can compare. 

good luck choosing - hag

[Mathew]

8 hours ago, haggis said:

I’ve just fitted the 123 programmable on my Gt6 mk1, had a long term problem with my lumenition unit, and a very worn distributor, couldn’t find a single curve (there were so many to compare) to put directly in, asked on here, searched the internet, eventually I got 123 to install a curve based on the Lucas number, it was rubbish and didn’t 

if by any chance someone does have the 123 curves for a 2000cc post rolling road please show so I can compare. 

good luck choosing - hag

 

 

That's interesting, where did you get yours from and how does it connect, problem is i only have a smart phone now and don't want to be buying laptops ect.

[haggis]

Bought mine direct from 123, but it was before brexit, only just got around to fitting. It’s all done on your smart phone/ tablet, really simple to use, does take some research though. They will pre-program a curve to match your dizzy, which was a good place to start. 
 

hag 
 

[AndyTV8]

7 hours ago, Mathew said:

That's interesting, where did you get yours from and how does it connect, problem is i only have a smart phone now and don't want to be buying laptops ect.

The 123-Tune+ connects to your phone/tablet via Bluetooth.  The 123-tune (no ‘+’) connects to a laptop via a micro-usb cable. 

If you don’t have a laptop you will need to choose the tune+ or the cheaper one which has 16 selectable pre-set curves (the 16 curves are fixed, but so cover quite a good range)

Available from most of the usual suspects, i had an email from Rimmer Bros with a 5% discount offer on all 123’s (clearly no adverse financial impacts following the end of the Brexit transition period!).

i have one arriving in the post tomorrow from Holden

....... Andy 

 

[avivalasvegas]

On 15/03/2021 at 22:01, haggis said:

 

I think the cost for the 123, the tacho conversion and rolling road will be more than I expected, but I did cure my problem. I now have an immobiliser and a very steady tacho and I lost a tacho cable from my crowded bulk head. 

 

Interestingly, after speaking with Collin at Atspeed, he didn't speak highly of the 123 at all. Hit and a miss, with more of a miss, was his description. 

He recommended sticking with the Magnetronic conversion and letting him have a go at the car and then suggested deciding on the purchase. Safe to say he sounded very experienced and had a GT6 and a TR6 at his location today.

[Pete Lewis]

yes a well set up 50 yr old sysytem can still give good results 

so I agree see what you have does then decide always steer round deep pocket syndrome  as a first step

Pete

[haggis]

I agree with Pete, I seemed to have acquired deep pockets on this occasion, not sure what came over me, I think it was lockdown boredom. Most people just carry a spare set of points in their emergency pack I’ve got to carry a whole distributor around with me. Whatever you choose, carry a spare setup. I always thought electronic ignition was fit and forget, but that’s not the case, they can go wrong like anything else.
 
hag 

[Mathew]

57 minutes ago, haggis said:

I agree with Pete, I seemed to have acquired deep pockets on this occasion, not sure what came over me, I think it was lockdown boredom. Most people just carry a spare set of points in their emergency pack I’ve got to carry a whole distributor around with me. Whatever you choose, carry a spare setup. I always thought electronic ignition was fit and forget, but that’s not the case, they can go wrong like anything else.
 
hag 

Your right, back in the 90's my sparkrite electronic ignition failed on the way to work. Replaced by points and condenser by the AA. I wonder if 25 years later they could get a set from the local motor factor and do the same.

[Nick Jones]

123 started out as switchable rather than programmable. 16 curves to choose from, none of them right.... said the critics, and there was some truth in it.  The 123Tune should answer that. Only 6 points for centrifugal and 5 for load though.

I’ve not messed with a 123 specifically, but programmable 3D ignition can give impressive results. The ignition control from my MS engine management brings as much benefit as the injection.  Distributor-less systems cost more and take more effort to fit. Pay your money, make your choice....

[AndyTV8]

The 123tune+ (I think the tune is the same) has 10 centrifugal advance data points by default - you don’t need to use them all if your curve is simple, and I haven’t tried adding more .... I only needed 8.

I think the same number is available for MAP advance (vacuum) -  I have only used 5  as that was all the WSM provided as my starting point.

...... Andy 

[Mjit]

12 hours ago, Nick Jones said:

123 started out as switchable rather than programmable. 16 curves to choose from, none of them right.... said the critics, and there was some truth in it.

I'm sure those same critics glossed over the fact that mechanical distrubutors probably can't even make the 16 curve mark - and even then wouldn't be able to hit those same points as quickly or consistently as the 123.

[Iain T]

So when fitting a 123 dizzy what's the solution for the mechanically driven tacho? 

Iain 

[Pete Lewis]

get an electric impulse drive  gets its pulses from off the coil /dizzy 12v . 

lots around    1500 spits had them  old ones were cylinder conscious  and smiths made  4  6 8 cyl versions 

many cheap chinese versions can be set to suit  

some take an impulse off the alternator , but you need to calibrate the rpm to the array of pulley sizes 

Pete

 

[Iain T]

Thanks Pete. 

[Pete Lewis]

Caerbont make all the smiths gauges and senders 

https://www.smiths-instruments.co.uk/classic

[AndyTV8]

3 hours ago, Iain T said:

So when fitting a 123 dizzy what's the solution for the mechanically driven tacho? 

Iain 

I was fortunate, on the TR wet-liner engine the tach drive comes from the pedestal which sits under the distributor - so I can keep the original mechanical drive with the 123

....... Andy 

[Iain T]

Thanks Pete and Andy, I fitted the Pertronix Ignitor 2 and Flamethrower coil which made a big improvement at tickover and general pickup.

As I would like to keep the Jaeger tacho if I want to do anything further I'll just get the Lucas dizzy refurbed. 

I've sent my water pump to EP Services as it had a slight dribble and he said he could reduce the length of the body by 20mm to give me enough radiator clearance to fit an uprated larger Spal electric fan. That and making some brackets to mount the fan is (at the moment) the sum of my twiddlin but not the end of the list! 

Iain 

[Pete Lewis]

why do you need a electric fan ???  

needs air flow under the bonnet  stick to what triumph tested   

Pete