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MG vs Triumph rilvary...


DVD3500

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In another forum there was a discussion about MG vs Triumph specifically Spitfire vs MGB.

I have never owned an MGB bit I never saw any at a racing event where they seemed to do very well! (SCCA and European sports car)

I have to admit I don't know MG that well but I know Triumph from many books and videos and I always got the impression that Triumph did extremely well under extreme circumstances. Maybe MG did as well.... I don't know...

I do know that before they were thrown together there was fierce rivalry for market share but I don't know what MG had over Triumph (if anything)...

Did MG make saloons?

Did they rally?

Just curious I guess... no agenda and no need to start a feud...

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In the 1930s and 1940s MG were unrivalled as small cheap sports cars and participated very successfully in all forms of competition including international.speed records.  Even when Triumphs came late on the scene in the 1950s they were always outsold by MG.  The BMC Competition Department was MG Abingdon.  Yes, MG did produce saloons, those of the 1930s were beautiful, later ones were just badge-engineered BMC or British Leyland group cars.img_3706.jpg

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11 hours ago, DVD3500 said:

In another forum there was a discussion about MG vs Triumph specifically Spitfire vs MGB.

I have never owned an MGB bit I never saw any at a racing event where they seemed to do very well! (SCCA and European sports car)

I have to admit I don't know MG that well but I know Triumph from many books and videos and I always got the impression that Triumph did extremely well under extreme circumstances. Maybe MG did as well.... I don't know...

I do know that before they were thrown together there was fierce rivalry for market share but I don't know what MG had over Triumph (if anything)...

Did MG make saloons?

I bought my first Spitfire as they were always regarded as a poor second to MGs; having been involved in rallying Midgets in the 1970s I just wanted a change. I always found the MG to be quite dated, the Spitfire was a much more modern design, yet as I grew older I sort of did a 360 and preferred the older styling. MGB GTs were everywhere but I never saw a GT6 until I joined the TSSC so again I loved the rarity.

It's like the MX5; there's a lot of rivalry, a lot of proud owners out there and while I'll tease them from time to time they're just the same as the rest of us with their preferred Marque. Good points and bad in all!

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My boss kept his single seater 1930's MG K type racer in the company foyer, lovely looking car with that small 6 cylinder supercharged engine. I squeezed into it one day, it was a very snug fit! The foyer always smelt of old cars......lovely.

It was very much like this one

https://images.app.goo.gl/ksS1zfPYWTE73ps88

Iain

 

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7 minutes ago, Pete Lewis said:

ive found most Classic owners give you a wave /regocognition nodd  , most MG owners dont nor Morgans 

me  I wave at anyone out for a drive ,

pete

 

Would that we would always greet every human with kindness... what a world that would be, eh?

For me Triumph is also a lot about the "what could have been" like the Fury or even a Stag that had been less of a bother to maintain.

I also prefer the styling of Triumphs. I feel they are much more unique than even Austin Healeys or MGs but maybe I haven't seen enough of them...

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7 hours ago, Colin Lindsay said:

I never saw a GT6 until I joined the TSSC so again I loved the rarity

 

6 hours ago, Pete Lewis said:

most MG owners

Never goes amiss in casual conversation/when being looked down the nose at by MGA drivers to draw their attention to the 'rarity' factor, same with E-Type owners.

Dick

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The B is roomier inside but that thumping engine gets on your wick compared to the smoothness of the GT6 engine, also six’s legroom excellent. The Triumph suspension is soo much better too., and styling the six leaves the B standing.

I upset my friend who has aMG B by telling him it’s a cut down Morris Oxford but there again I’m a Triumph man

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There's a great quote about the GT6 vs the MGB in one of our Triumph books; goes something along the lines of "The GT6 was a pretty Italian car designed in the era of pretty Italian cars, whilst the MGB had a heavy rear axle, dated styling and all the charm of a J4 van...."

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I have never owned an MG, but my Dad, bless him, has owned a couple of MGB GTs, which I enjoyed driving as an alternative to my initially  GT6,  later on spitfires. The MGB GT  just felt sturdier, more modern and less floppy. Down to the far better monocoque design. I experienced the same feeling when I changed my road rally car from a Herald to a Toledo, the difference was night and day. However, the floppy chassis cars had got under my skin, so I still have a couple of spitfires.

As to rivalry, 30 years ago it was rife, but today it has all but disappeared. Classic car owners are banding together to survive, so we have seen Triumphs and MGs thrown together. The spares day was the first I think, and some complained they didn't like the idea. But it was either a joint event, or no event. I know what I wanted. And I have done several Trackdays in my spitfire with the MGCC (NOT to be confused with the MGOC, which is a private company out there to make a profit) and they are a friendly bunch. And now we have the MGCC as a partner for the Triumph/MG weekend. 

And to put it in perspective, I reckon the TSSC has about 4-5k members? (gut feeling) TRR rather more, but no figure available. But the MGCC? last figures I saw were 55K! But that is worldwide with many USA members, and the club is over 90 years old now. So joining forces is a great way forward for all of us, bringing the "little British sports car" movement together enabling bigger/better events. I am very much a fan of these collaborations.

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1 hour ago, clive said:

And to put it in perspective, I reckon the TSSC has about 4-5k members? (gut feeling) TRR rather more, but no figure available. But the MGCC? last figures I saw were 55K! But that is worldwide with many USA members, and the club is over 90 years old now. So joining forces is a great way forward for all of us, bringing the "little British sports car" movement together enabling bigger/better events. I am very much a fan of these collaborations.

That's a two-edged sword... :)

I've been to joint MG / Triumph Shows, and especially remember the parts suppliers and the autojumble... MG... MG... MG... MG... MG... Triumph.... MG... MG... MG... MG... we're outnumbered and sometimes it can feel like the poor relation.  Most of the suppliers who supply both Marques concentrated on the MG end of things. Surely there are more than just two great British marques who hold shows and events, and we could get together with someone more our own size??

 

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2 hours ago, clive said:

The MGB GT  just felt sturdier, more modern and less floppy.

Exactly!

We have honorary Sunbeam members, 2 x Tigers and 1 Alpine, they started coming to the Shire Horse the same night as us a couple of years ago. But we drew the line at the Fiat Owner's Club who wanted us to give up 2nd Tuesdays and come on Wednesdays. The AO said they had BBQs in the car park, I asked the Landlord, he said "***??*!! that! They can dream on! Are they insured?!!" 

Doug

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I went down the Triumph path rather than MG one for no other reason than  I drove a friend’s Mk 2 GT6  one afternoon in   mid 1974.

I was very impressed by the acceleration and the engines smoothness and it looked fantastic.

I was less  impressed by the gearbox noise and when I opened the door to get out the loud “clack” from the door restrainer  made me wince and apologise to him as I thought I must have broken  something!

I suppose I might have as easily had a spin  in  an MG that afternoon, but I didn’t - and I ended up buying his GT6.

( which incidentally, he bought back from me three years later!)
 

 

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I have owned a few MGs including a 1932 J2, 1937 TA, 1952 TD and assorted MGBs and GTs including an MGB GT V8 (the nicest).  I was actually looking at Heritage re-shelled MGB GTs when I spotted my current Triumph GT6 Mk3 and heart over-ruling head I bought her.  She is certainly far prettier than any MGB but has always appeared very fragile and lightweight compared to the sturdy MGBs which for many years both my wife and I used reliabily as our everyday commuting cars.

 

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I think alot of this is to do with brand loyalty.  I remember for years i would ride a kawasaki bike , not entertain getting a honda. Then i bought one and it was quite a good bike. After that it did not matter the make but was it any good. If you can get enjoyment it must be good.

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19 hours ago, Colin Lindsay said:

That's a two-edged sword... :)

I've been to joint MG / Triumph Shows, and especially remember the parts suppliers and the autojumble... MG... MG... MG... MG... MG... Triumph.... MG... MG... MG... MG... we're outnumbered and sometimes it can feel like the poor relation.  Most of the suppliers who supply both Marques concentrated on the MG end of things. Surely there are more than just two great British marques who hold shows and events, and we could get together with someone more our own size??

 

Better than being all MG. And us being left at home.

And don't expect Jag/Healey/Lotus/Ford/Rootes/Mini etc to be good companions. They either have numerous owners clubs (there is no UK wide Mini club, or wasn't a few years ago, they are all local ones) and Ford seem to have a club for almost every model. Some Clubs have members with rather odd attitudes too. When the TRR did their first joint weekend with the SOC (both good sized Clubs in their own right) I saw some interesting comments. One TR owner summed up much of the sentiment, paraphrased to "why do I want to see lardy touring cars at my show for sports cars" but there were others with a better, open and welcoming attitude. Thankfully the TRR has moved on, and the TSSC are lucky enough to have been welcomed. 

But the mgb  onwards cars have a broadly similar value to spitfires/GT6, probably a similar owners profile too. And as you noted many suppliers sell parts for both marques, making show attendance viable. Something just us could not achieve. Simple economics. Canley Classics gave up attending the Stafford show many years ago. They were simply not selling anything like enough over even a busy weekend to cover costs, even taking into account the publicity of being at the show and resulting orders after. 

As to the big showground events, many people are miffed at the cost of entry to the joint TRR/TSSC show. They are used to free entry if in a classic, or £10 etc. But it will cost me £45 for weekend entry, with camping. It will put many off. Just think, if expected numbers go down, entry costs have to go up. This year may see a profit for the clubs, but if it is a washout, poor attendance, it could see clubs making substantial losses. I really hope that is not the case, and we have a glorious weekend. And I intend to enjoy pottering about, seeing Triumph friends, (one of whom also owns a 1940s MGF which just makes you smile whenever you go out in it) Drink a few beers, watch the flypast, have a go at their driving event, maybe buy a few odds and ends and snooze in the sunshine. All rather god stuff, and having TRs and MGs there will add to the enjoyment. I especially like seeing te everyday, used and abused cars over the lineups of polished garage queens, but I realise many people like shiny stuff. So something for everybody. 

I really think we need to be grateful to the Clubs committees working together and putting these events on. It won't have been easy, but we are the ones who benefit. 

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If Colin's current estimate of 4.5 - 5K TSSC members is fairly accurate, then that's a bit of an eye opener. IIRC membership peaked at about 14K in the early 90's. Trying to encourage modern youth to take an interest in our cars, beyond just walking past them at shows is the challenge. After all, as has been said many times down the years - " We are merely custodians" 😕

Gav

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Owners want to attend shows for free, or use the facilities of the club for free. Everyone wants events but won't pay, or the benefit and assistance of the TSSC, but won't pay. I'm always asked: what do I get for my money? They should be asking: what have I lost by not supporting? I know owners who will spend thousands on uprating their Triumphs but not £40 on membership as they 'can't afford it'... 

The Standard motor Club will do nothing for anyone who isn't a member: "Do not waste our volunteers valuable time if you are not prepared to join". I wonder how they survive at £39 annual membership?

As for Clive's comment: "Better than being all MG. And us being left at home." That's the option these days? I feel we deserve more than that. I do so hate being the poor relation... :)

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