chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 UPDATE... So its all looking good from an oil leak persperctive. Rear crank seal and sump both seemed to have stopped leaking as do the few pesky seals that i changed on the box while it was out. I replaced the friction plate while the box was out and also the slave cylinder cus that decided to seize, put it all back together and i could get gears but had no drive, prop was spinning but not moving the car. Spoke to my mechanice mate who didnt know what it was so suggested putting the old plate back in and seeing how it was with that. So box back out and put the old plate back in, with the back end up on axles the wheels am spinning through the gears but as soon as its got the resistance of the weight of the car it wont drive, but the prop is spinning which is pointing to a diff issue i imagine? Strange thing is i havent touched the diff and it was driving ok before so unless its a terrible coincidence that an issue has just appeared with the diff then i really am baffled as to what is going on with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 Is the prop DEFINITELY still turning with both wheel stationary? Id imagine that it spins with the wheels off the ground just by a bit of friction from crank to gearbox input shaft but because the clutch isnt engaged properly as soon as theres any load the prop will stop turning... **** Be careful what youre doing as Im worried the clutch might grip spontaneously at anytime with the engine running and in gear with the wheels on the ground😵 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 agree with wheels off the deck the prop will spin , hopefully wheels on the deck stops the spin . why put the old plate back in thats a bit nuts this sounds more like the slave (or such) is holding the clutch disengaged diffs dont give up the drive whilst standing idle if the prop turns when wheels on ground i would suspect a short shaft failure (diff output shaft) but thats a real unlikely pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I have heard of new friction plates being put in that are slightly different from the original or put in the wrong way round so that they then stop the clutch from engaging.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 wrong way round ..........reckon that normally gives permanent drive as the disc hub fouls the flywheel bolts and you cant disengage Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 all will be revealed, hopefully! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 Friction plate is 100% the right way round. And prop is 100% spinning when the wheels are on the ground. At first it thought the clutch was slipping but then the prop wouldnt turn. Its spinning more the more i rev so thats why i suspect a diff issue. But as i say i havent touched the diff and i had no problems with drive at all before. Pete, i put the old one back in to eliminate wether it was the wrong plate and my mate recommended it as it was baffling us both why diff was spinning but no drive. The old plate still had some friction material on it so if it was ok with the old one i was gona leave that one on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 edit just seen you reply Chris if the prop is turning with the wheels on the ground there is definitley a diff problem you can take the short shafts out without removing the diff these can shear but normally when tanking off the line or lots of power on full lock most odd this has happened swapping the gearbox out check them first dont start dreaming of crown wheel problems etc fit the new disc and dont take the box off anymore Pete to loose drive by refitting a geabox is somewhat abnormal doing the easy first I would start with the actuation start at the pedal ,is it fully returning ?? and work to the slave has it jammed the pushrod ?? then dream about the throw out has the pivot pin fallen out ?? pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 Yes it is abnormal which is what is baffling me Pedal is fully returning, brand new slave and it is working as should be, i can see the fork moving forward and back down the little gap at the side of the slave as i press and release the pedal If the pivot pin had fallen out would the fork not be operational at all? If so then no i dont think its fallen out. I didnt touch the t.o bearing or fork or anything g.box side other than a new slave cylinder as the old one had seized Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 8 minutes ago, chrisbladen said: And prop is 100% spinning when the wheels are on the ground. Is the input flange to the differential also rotating when the wheels are on the ground?. I presume the propshaft was disconnected when you removed the gearbox. Has something in the propshaft, such as the sliding yoke depending which propshaft you have, failed so it can no longer transmit enough torque ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 If all these things check out then theres got to be a diff problem and forget the gearbox/clutch, at least for now. Hasnt got a limited slip unit fitted in the diff has it? No noise from the it? I would expect it to sound like a bag of nails and/or go bang pretty soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 check what graham suggests to get the short shafts out you drop the drive shaft coupling and the holes in the short sahft coupling align with the socket cap screws for an allen key access they then just slip out if both shafts are intact its time to drop the diff and examine just what the heck has happended when the prop is turning are the drive shafts stationary ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 Il check it out, have wait till i can get some1 up here with me to put it in gear so i can check whats going on underneath. Just as a side note, when i tightened the pressure plate back down the fingers on it started to pull in, i wasnt sure if they was going in too far but my mate said thats normal when you tighten the 6 bolts. Heres a pic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 that sounds right to me. As you do up the last bit on the pressure plate bolts the diaphragm spring assembly has to push on the friction plate so you feel resistance and the fingers will start to flex... Anyway the diff is all the focus now as weve identified 100% theres a problem with it👍 However check and double check before starting major works on it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 7 minutes ago, johny said: that sounds right to me. As you do up the last bit on the pressure plate bolts the diaphragm spring assembly has to push on the friction plate so you feel resistance and the fingers will start to flex... Anyway the diff is all the focus now as weve identified 100% theres a problem with it👍 However check and double check before starting major works on it.... Thats ok then, seems like all must be ok box/clutch side. I cant believe theres an issue with the diff thats just coincidentally started after iv had the box off, but all iv done diff end is undone the prop and then reconnected. Seems like 2 much of a bad coincidence that a fault has started after this, im hoping its just something silly and simple but i cant think what it could be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 what did Einstein say? Something like, when youve discounted all the possible only the impossible is left! Or was that someone else🤓 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 i think the fingers look too flat what disc is in there ?? you dont need to fire the car up if there is lost drive simply turn the propshaft by hand (use a lever if needed in the UJ ) if it turns you have a diff problem thats if safely jacked and hand brake on firmly one other simple test when jacked of the shafts/diff gears put in 1st gear turn one wheel by hand other wheel should rotate opposite way if it doesnt its a short shaft failure but why ??? Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 I thought they looked a bit flat which is why i questioned it. This is the disc that was in there https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GCP230 But as i say i have put the original back in and the fingers looked about the same to be honest. I will also try the short shaft test. Everything seems to be pointing at the diff, butbas you said i am just thinking why? Why god why 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 2, 2021 Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 another suggestion to check the differential gears one jack under the upright lift one wheel when you turn the wheel the prop must turn do the same on other wheel just lift one and rotate , watch the prop at the same time i will look up the disc thickness in the morning a coil clutch has a thicker disc than a diaphragm being too thick will over travel the fingers , true as the disc wears the fingers will move outwards i would expect as new fingers more / depressed | not start | and \ depressed sorry cant draw on here Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2021 Ok thanks i will give that a go aswell. Spoke to 2 transmission specialists and they am also baffled by this. This motor will be the death of me! Thanks for all the advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 3, 2021 Report Share Posted June 3, 2021 when you get to the bottom of whats happend the smile will return you dont need a specialist if the prop is turning and the cars not the diff /drive line has a break in it somewhere cant explain why its happened till we know just whats decided to fail ...on the drive an unusual TEE shirt moment Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted June 4, 2021 Report Share Posted June 4, 2021 That looks a very rusty clutch cover in the kit. Assuming you purchased just the friction plate, is it the same make as the cover, as different plates need different covers, well certainly on 2000's so I assume same on Spitfires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted June 4, 2021 Report Share Posted June 4, 2021 On 21/05/2021 at 19:48, chrisbladen said: Update... Flywheel and back plate removed which has confirmed the crank seal has been leaking so thats a positive. However, it looks like the core plug has also been leaking, which iv read am a right ball ache to get out with the engine in the car. Iv also read to cover the sealing edge in some sort of lock tight before fitting a new plug. Im just hoping that this is the source of the water and not what appears to be slight corrosion on the block directly underneath the core plug 🤦♂️ I think talc left for a while to confirm Is that not the other end of the camshaft, so I would not expect it to leak water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 4, 2021 Report Share Posted June 4, 2021 on the disc thickness i have had a look cant find definitive for the diaphragm but diaphragm discs are thinner than coil units you must never mix them up as pedal loads and clamp loads come down very low the coil cover disc thickness ( lightly clamped in a vice ) 8,4mm to compare a 8" vitesse diaphragm disc is 7.1mm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisbladen Posted June 9, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2021 So a new update, i havent touched it for a week due to work but needed to move it out the garage yesterday to get something past, before i pushed it out i just tried it and i had drive??? only reversed it slowly out and then pulled it slowly back in. Went i went to move faster i heard a slight crunching noise from the diff. Tried again today and now it seems i have full drive back. I have only drove it on the forecourt at the back of my garage so only up in to 2nd gear and its driving ok. If i go to pull away with some haste then i sometimes get that same crunching noise. But im unsure how iv gone from having drive to having no drive from the diff whatsoever to its driving again and i haven't done a thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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