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PeterH
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9 hours ago, Chris A said:

That is an interesting point.

Does this mean that we are an endangered species and doomed to extinction?

My youngest grandson, who lives in Texas, had to search around for an instructor who actually had a Manual car, in order to take his driving test, Virtually ALL car`s sold in the USA are automatic, be they ICE or E-V`s. He like his Father and Mother, who both learned to drive over here of course. are amongst the few who have the skill set. Mostly Ex Pats.

Pete

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11 hours ago, Chris A said:

Does this mean that we are an endangered species and doomed to extinction?

Going by many of the posts in this thread I thought that was already a certainty. However: you'll be able to take the 'manual' part of the driving test as a personal preference, maybe even an additional section like the trailer test.

I have American and Canadian relatives and they all think we're mad using 'stick shifts'. 

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My last few daily drivers have all been automatics - did go to a manual defender after an automatic Audi for a couple of years - not sure I'd go back to a manual for everyday use - but wouldn't really bother me if I did.

The other three cars in the fleet at home are all manuals and I switch to them all the time - but my Mum's who I'm also insured to drive is an auto - she won't go back to a manual now - but at 81 I don't blame her!

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2 hours ago, PeteH said:

My youngest grandson, who lives in Texas, had to search around for an instructor who actually had a Manual car, in order to take his driving test, Virtually ALL car`s sold in the USA are automatic, be they ICE or E-V`s. He like his Father and Mother, who both learned to drive over here of course. are amongst the few who have the skill set. Mostly Ex Pats.

Pete

In japan its the same, approx 95% of all home market cars are autos, all the young people only pass the auto test. My wife's dad was a truck driver and he had her do the manual test, but that was 20 years ago. It's rarer now.

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39 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said:

However: you'll be able to take the 'manual' part of the driving test as a personal preference,

Yes, but in what? Once the driving schools switch over to EVs how does a novice get to practice and take a test in a manual? Are people still allowed to have mum or dad sat at the side of them in a private car & take their test in it? This assumes mum or dad have a manual? Here I don't think you can learn in anything but a 'proper' school car.

How many young drivers will even think of taking the manual option at the time of their test? They won't be thinking that they will be buying a classic. It is more likely older drivers will take the option when they have the good taste to want a classic.

Better get out there and do auto conversions to all the classics ready for the boom in demand 🤑

When my wife was learning to drive she had difficulty and her teacher suggested trying an auto. Passed test quickly after. In her view why drive a manual, an auto means less to concentrate on. We bought her an auto Citröen when we moved her with auto wipers and lights. When she was test driving it I said to the salesman, she could do with a warning about the handbrake being on - it has one he replied.

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I wouldn't go back to manual for a modern daily car. The auto boxes, are so good now with more gears (mine has 8!) than you would ever want in a manual box. I'd get lost with 8 manual gears! 

The one new gizmo I do turn off is the stop/start as I hate the constant engine starting in traffic. I know its supposed to be environmentally friendly but is that just smoke n mirrors? 

Iain 

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44 minutes ago, Iain T said:

The one new gizmo I do turn off is the stop/start as I hate the constant engine starting in traffic

Mine has stop start, it doesn't get much use as there isn't much traffic around here 😁

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1 hour ago, Iain T said:

I wouldn't go back to manual for a modern daily car. The auto boxes, are so good now with more gears (mine has 8!) than you would ever want in a manual box. I'd get lost with 8 manual gears! 

The one new gizmo I do turn off is the stop/start as I hate the constant engine starting in traffic. I know its supposed to be environmentally friendly but is that just smoke n mirrors? 

Iain 

Smoke and mirrors, in my view - and a friend of mine who is very much into the green stuff.

Long term (As in past the warranty) they are going to cause bigger problems. My BMW I coded it to default to being turned off - but still functioned if you wanted it to. But the Skoda can't be done so easily and you have to code the temperature limits - which means its inoperable as far as I know. I would say the former is legal, the latter less so as you are actually messing with emissions stuff.

I turn it off 99% of the time - and when I don't there is no difference to the MPG that I've been able to measure. Which isn't the same as emissions - but unless it hits the bank account most people wont change.

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Just now, Iain T said:

Try driving in London! Best avoided at all times. 

I get the train 9 times out of 10. I did go to a job on a Sunday - but it was outside the zones and I could park on site for free! And trains on a sunday aren't great - and it was still very much in the pandemic.

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1 minute ago, Anglefire said:

turn it off 99% of the time - and when I don't there is no difference to the MPG

Exactly the cars made to conform to badly formulated test criteria. If you're in a jam that only moves every 5+ minutes perhaps there is a benefit but in constantly moving slow traffic no! 

We take the tube as it's free for my wife and I😁

 

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19 hours ago, Chris A said:

There has just been an item of the news where the reporter used a Renault ZOe to go from Paris to La Rochelle. Before setting off they planned the 2 recharging stops they would need. They also worked out that they would have to drive relatively slowly compared to an ice. At the first no problems, other than it took 1 1/2 hours to charge. At the second there wasn't a cable that matched their car, luckily they found another close enough so they didn't run out. Again 1 1/2 hours to charge.

Total time for the journey 11 hours, 5 longer than with a ice. At least the cost was less, around 20 Euros of electricity.

My neighbours across the road have one, for long trips they use their old diesel

It's a well known fact among EV circles the Zoe only has "single phase" recharging meaning the speed of charging is limited to about 11 KW per hour. Given the 30 to 40 KW size of the battery (models vary) that makes total sense...

The Skoda Enyaq has an 80 KW battery that can be fully charged in 40 minutes on a 125 KW fast charger allowing for a 300 to 400 km real world range.

I reckon they didn't do their homework and went to a fast charging station where the cables are attached to charger as the electricity going through them is very powerful.

All "normal" charging stations i.e. under 125 KW expect you to bring your own cable so why they didn't have "correct" cable shows they didn't do their homework.

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40 minutes ago, DVD3500 said:

It's a well known fact among EV circles the Zoe only has "single phase" recharging meaning the speed of charging is limited to about 11 KW per hour. Given the 30 to 40 KW size of the battery (models vary) that makes total sense...

The Skoda Enyaq has an 80 KW battery that can be fully charged in 40 minutes on a 125 KW fast charger allowing for a 300 to 400 km real world range.

I reckon they didn't do their homework and went to a fast charging station where the cables are attached to charger as the electricity going through them is very powerful.

All "normal" charging stations i.e. under 125 KW expect you to bring your own cable so why they didn't have "correct" cable shows they didn't do their homework.

Maybe they had done their homework and their intention was to show how tricky it was with an EV, i.e. they were biased.

After all there are, as you say, better about. although maybe they chose the ZOE because there are more of them on the roads here than any other make/model.

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6 hours ago, Chris A said:

Yes, but in what?

Have they changed the rules on Driving Tests, from when you were able to be tested in your own vehicle? Long time since I needed to know, but if you turn up in a manual car are you able to be tested in that, or must it be the Driving Instructor's vehicle these days?

So: if you want to drive your old family-owned Triumph every day, is it a case of learning as you go along, having been instructed and tested in an automatic?

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2 minutes ago, Anglefire said:

I think it has to have dual controls for your test - no idea where I get that information from apart from its in my memory!

 

That would make sense because in the case of an emergency or the learner freezing the examiner can stop the car.

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7 minutes ago, Anglefire said:

I think it has to have dual controls for your test - no idea where I get that information from apart from its in my memory!

 

Found it on the Gov website:

https://www.gov.uk/driving-test/using-your-own-car

You can use your own car provided it meets the required spec (Mini convertibles don't due to lack of all-round visibility!) If you are tested in automatic or semi-automatic, that's all you're allowed to drive.

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13 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said:

Found it on the Gov website:

https://www.gov.uk/driving-test/using-your-own-car

You can use your own car provided it meets the required spec (Mini convertibles don't due to lack of all-round visibility!) If you are tested in automatic or semi-automatic, that's all you're allowed to drive.

Learn something everyday!

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1 hour ago, Chris A said:

they were biased.

Are you suggesting that someone might actual print/post something that ISN'T TRUE?!

My Goodness I might lose my faith in Humanity...

In fairness, I am supposed to get my Enyaq in March. I will likely have to trailer my Spitfire to a guy a good 150 KM away to get the the camber, toe in etc all set up as it likely won't be road legal at the point. While I can hook it up to the Enyaq (it has a trailer hitch) I don't have real world experience if it can make it there and back on one charge.

There are places to charge but I would have to unhook the trailer likely.... with any luck the shop I am taking it to will have 400 volt connector I could use (I have an adapter set for the car) so it charges while we set up the car. It is a not perfect but it is all doable...

I have said it before. EVs are not perfect but I think they are better than a lot of people think.

 

BTW: I saw a special on  PBS about "The Great Electric Plane Race" now THERE is a situation where hydrogen would be really good...

 

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On 01/08/2021 at 08:58, Colin Lindsay said:

Going by many of the posts in this thread I thought that was already a certainty. However: you'll be able to take the 'manual' part of the driving test as a personal preference, maybe even an additional section like the trailer test.

I have American and Canadian relatives and they all think we're mad using 'stick shifts'. 

You will only be able to take a manual "add-on" if you have been taught in a manual, and they'd won't be available New after 2030.

Examiners will not allow you to use your own car now I think as it may not be safe.

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On 01/08/2021 at 17:53, Colin Lindsay said:

Me too, I just hope I never have to be retested... :)

I did!, At the age of 60. I had just bought an American R-V, which was Plated at 9tonne!. Thinking I was OK to drive it through "grandad rights". BIG mistake. They had changed the rules on HGV testing back in the 70`s. And because I did`nt get a Medical and get it signed off. I had lost said rights. Cost me over a Grand to do a short course and re-take. Passed first time. Went on to do a bit of part time agency HGV work. Helped pay for the Diesel.

Pete

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