Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 I’ve just purchased a 1600 vitesse 6. I have an issue which has been inherited from the PO. The clutch is without question not fully engaging as selecting 1st or reverse you are met with a grinding. Driving out is fine. hydraulics bled - all new - movement at slave is good. Clutch is new and the gearbox looks fully rebuilt. No excessive play in the pedal linkages. The hydraulics simply run out of travel. The control arm into the gearbox flops around a lot - there’s just too much travel before the bearing mates with the seat on the pressure plate. I’ve pulled the gearbox out this morning - can anyone please confirm the bearing thickness - looking at rimmers is supposed to be a GRB206. The bearing I have is 16mm there abouts. the pivot point isn’t worn - nor is the control arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 The whole lot in there is new chap. This is something silly for sure. The movement on the control arm is massive FullSizeRender.mov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 I'm wondering why it's just first and reverse... these probably don't have synchromesh, but why no issues with the other gears? I've measured a Herald coil-clutch bearing by eye just now; slightly over 17mm but that's not a precise measurement. You may have a pin sheared, or badly worn, at the bottom of that lever, but you won't confirm wear or damage until it's completely removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 The control arm is fine - no wear in the pivot pin obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 Hydraulics fine - all new - movement is all good from the slave. If you watch the video - you can see the control arm movement is huge - loads of free play. That i believe is my issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve P Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 Has the bearing carrier got swapped for one that is too short,i think there are 3 types?.I see you have the short brass type. I could only find an image of a 2 litre one and that looks longer but that would be for a diaphragm clutch. S 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 This is what I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 9 minutes ago, Steve P said: Has the bearing carrier got swapped for one that is too short,i think there are 3 types?.I see you have the short brass type. I could only find an image of a 2 litre one and that looks longer but that would be for a diaphragm clutch. S I’ve not idea chap - this is an inherited issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 15 minutes ago, Mathew said: That does seem like alot of free play prior to engagement. The pivot point is definitely correct. Does it have the shoes on the pins for the carrier on the Vitesse? Dunno chap - I’ve stuck up some pics of what I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve P Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 Had a bit of a look online,the 1600 should have a shorter carrier than later ones,also a flat bearing face which yours doesn`t look like it is. What about the length of the slave operating rod?.. Steve 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 I can measure that @Steve P - but at the full extent of current travel the arm almost hits the gearbox case - I’ve even tried the trick of sneaking a nut in between the arm and the rod to increase travel - again it’s limited by the gearbox case. this is definitely related to there being too much free movement - which is down to carrier or bearing being the issue. the bearing I have cross references to the GRB206 so - it’s either the wrong thickness and a bad cross reference or the carrier is to blame…… I do notice the carrier is NLA according to rimmers 🤔 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
68vitesse Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 132080 Clutch lever, common to all Vitesse and GT6. GRB206 Release Bearing, Spit.1, Herald to 65 coil spring clutch and Vitesse 6 also coil spring. 116298 Bearing carrier, unique to Vitesse 6. Slave cylinder should have a spring in it to take up free travel, self adjusting. Regards Paul 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 many aftermarket throwouts are 15mm thick the correct is 19mm thick this upsets the angles easy cheat is pop out the spherical post and add a washer as a spacer on the back between hsg and gearbox face pins look good , yes should be a flat faced bearing grb206 is in stock at canley;s.. for coil clutches you should have a 7/8" dia bore slave cyl. keep bleed nipple at the top and depress the slave to reduce volume Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 @68vitesse does the carrier in the pic above look correct? If so it would appear I’ve an issue with the bearing. @Pete Lewis any idea of a source for the correct 19mm bearing ? If I can’t - what’s the correct washer thickness to pad out the pivot pin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 And how does that pivot pin come out ? Is it bolted in from behind the bell housing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 7 minutes ago, Barrykearley said: And how does that pivot pin come out ? Is it bolted in from behind the bell housing ? The pivot pin is driven out , easy to do , find a washer to fit and refit the pin . I glued the washer in , Paul 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 Fab so I should just be able to pull that pin out and shim it then. I will try and get a thicker bearing tomorrow - but failing that it’s shim time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul H Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 This is the bearing cap set up on my mk2 Vitesse , virtually no play Paul 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 I would expect a MM or two at the pushrod end of the arm - I’ve got absolutely miles of movement. It was about 3mm looking into the gearbox between the bearing and mating face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 for a coil clutch your throwout brg is just very wrong i do not recommend this to be refitted it must be a flat faced brg. not a contured like youres is i thas to GO !!!! the slave should move its piston out by its self and put the brg. up against the cover platform apart from the wrong bearing it woud seem the pushrod is too short if the slave has run out of travel in the foot off position a thicker bgr will help but me thinks something else is wrong here get the one from canley classics they know whats needed Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 @Pete Lewis the bearing is flat faced - that picture doesn’t make it look like it - but it is. It’s 16mm and there’s significant play before that flat face mates with the sprung face of the clutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 Old bearing has CT 5466 stamped on it. physically it’s about 68mm outer diameter, 38mm inner diameter, 16mm thick. All approx since I’ve just binned my digital vernier thats refusing to work. This cross refs to a GRB206 bearing and is what should be in the car according to rimmers. It looks about 3mm too thin to me by peering in the bellhousing So tomorrow - I’ll be ordering the GRB209 - since that’s 19.63mm thick according to a dimension I’ve managed to find - and I reckon that’s gonna solve this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrykearley Posted October 3, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 Scratch that - the GRB209 isnt a flat faced contact bearing. I'm starting to think I have a 2000cc bearing carrier in this car. I’ll pop into a mates machine shop tomorrow and see if he can rattle me up a shim to go between the rear of the bearing I have and the carrier to push it out a few mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 CT5466 is the correct bearing for the Vitesse 1600, also early Triumph Heralds to 1965 and the earlier Spitfire models too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted October 3, 2021 Report Share Posted October 3, 2021 the 2ltr diaphragm clutch carrier is much longer then the coil clutch unit , as the stand of of the platform is much closer to the flywheel than the coil cover accepting you have a thin brg the slave should still have enough travel to put the brg in contact all you get wrong then is the see saw angle of the lever it all one way hence correct it by spacing the post a bit so diaphragm has long carrier coil has much shorter not the other way round Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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