SixasStandard

Hello All, Now this is a difficult one...…..and I realise that as a 'Newbie' I run the risk of rubbing some people up the wrong way by raising it......but who is it exactly that sets the values of cars when the phrase 'valued at xx' (where 'xx' appears to be some totally unrealistic figure) is quoted in so many online adverts? I'm currently looking for a 2 Litre Vitesse Saloon, which albeit a lovely vehicle (hence me wanting one) is not what I would consider a particularly exotic vehicle...…...and yet I'm seeing ads asking for 12k to 13k...…..or else cars pitched slightly lower but quoting this as their 'valued at' price. When I look on the Practical Classics Price Guide it gives the Concours or Dealer price of these cars at 7.5K...….with Condition 1 significantly lower...…..so there just seems to be a disconnect somewhere, or am I missing something? Classic Cars are not an investment...…..not at our level anyway...….so I can only assume that these peoples' estimates of their car's worth is somehow related to how much they've spent to restore and improve them...…….not what the market says they're actually worth. Are cars actually selling at these values?...…...or do they just sit around on the classifieds ad-infinitum? Like I said...….I've no desire to upset anyone, I just want to understand where these (what I consider) inflated prices are coming from. Regards, Ian

Thanks Nick, It sounds like a Mk2 spec car upgraded with a CV conversion offers the optimal solution of performance, predictability and reliability...……...but at a cost. Regards, Ian

Thanks Nick, It is useful to get anecdotal evidence from someone who has done a lot of long distance driving, and it confirms what I thought would likely be the case. The Supra gearbox sounds interesting, although I imagine that supply will be just as troublesome and the cost just high as that for the Type9? I wonder if there are more modern alternatives?......the Mazda MX5 gearbox is now being offered by (ironically) a company called 'Vitesse' in Hinckley, Leicestershire...…..but only for the TR cars according to their website. I'll give them a call to find out more. Thanks for your insights. Ian

Don't worry about the 'thread drift' Roger...…...I successfully exited the thread some time ago after entering with the right amount of energy, without lifting off, and then powering out with only minimal oversteer. Regards, Ian

Thanks everyone for your contributions, as for losing sleep Richard...…...I don't sleep anymore...….at night I'm plugged into a 'collective' like the Borg to assimilate more information on Triumph overdrive transmissions...…….resistance is futile apparently! Regards, Ian

Thanks Richard/Johny, Richard........the reason I'm asking at this stage is that my intention will be to occasionally use the Vitesse on long distance continental tours, perhaps even as far South as Italy...…..so periods of motorway cruising will inevitably be required, regardless of how scenic the route we choose to take. I wouldn't want to be clowning about at 40mph on an Autostrade ……… certainly not with the 'intente cordiale' so dented by recent political events. Long story short I will need to fit an O/D or five speed box to any car that I purchase which doesn't already have one...…..so the question is significant to my choice of car should the practicality of a conversion be too troublesome or expensive...…..ergo my query. Johny……… the wind noise issue is one that I hadn't considered, and I'm sure it has an effect on driving speeds for the majority of drivers coping with their usual domestic driving. For the longer trips that I'm occasionally hoping to make with 'the Boss' I think that a 5th gear or O/D box would prove to be essential. The higher ratio differential is a good tip....thanks. Regards, Ian

Hello All, As part of my search for a 2L Vitesse I may have to face the prospect of a good car coming along which ticks a lot of boxes apart from the O/D one! If such a car does come along then comments from previous threads suggest that O/D is a real necessity to make the car more usable and enjoyable. Bearing in mind I don't come into the 'private yacht / diamond encrusted Rolex / private Caribbean island' sector of the ownership spectrum...….. how straightforward and expensive is it to remedy the situation? (the O/D gearbox...….not my credit rating). I would welcome other Forum members' thoughts on my options. From my current (horrifically inexperienced) perspective the options would seem to be: 1) Don't be daft...….wait for a car with O/D. 2) Be daft......but source and fit an OE Triumph unit when one appears for sale. 3) As above, but use the surplus Laycock O/D unit from my Sunbeam Alpine, after a rebuild and necessary mods to said box and the Vitesse propshaft. 4) Sell a kidney on the Dark Web, and after recovering use the funds towards a Type 9 conversion kit from the usual suspects...…..topping up the purchase price from savings. 5) Take up another hobby like full contact crochet. All insights are welcome. I would particularly appreciate knowing the practicalities of adding O/D, and if anyone on the Forum has actually gone this route already. Thanks, Ian

Hello Steve, That's quite a fire breathing Vitesse you have there!! Did you keep the original engine block and replace the crank and pistons for 2.5 versions? or do a straight swap with a complete 2.5L engine? To get 170 BHP I imagine that you're running a PI system? Ian

Richard, The 1600cc engine that I've taken out of the Alpine (and which is now surplus to requirements due to my recon 1725cc and box) has an O/D unit fitted, do I recall correctly that you mentioned previously it would be usable for the Vitesse with some machining mods? All of this will be academic if I find a car with O/D, but I'd like to be prepared for the worst case. Ian

Unfortunately my Alpine O/D box isn't going to be doing any singing for some time I'm afraid!

Pete, just to add to the current 'scope creep' of my initial thread...... can I ask your opinion on the Ford Type 9 gearbox conversions that are out there? If a good car came up that fitted my wish list but lacked an O/D box......would it be better to consider a Type 9, or else get hold of a correct spec O/D unit? Ian

Crikey!...…..the 'bad hair day' thing would be a major issue in our household...….the better half's barnet is a major ongoing project, so any turbulence induced damage would result in me getting a right 'handbaggin'...…...definitely no sunroof then!! Ian

Thanks Colin/Johny/Clive, It seems that axle tuck under and snap oversteer are alive and well if you're 'giving it the beans' and then find that the 'beans' run out mid manoeuvre. Forewarned is definitely forearmed!! Clive, I assume the significance of the Courier spring is a higher spring rate to cope with a commercial payload? If such a spring were to be used on a Mk1 would it potentially make the ride a bit harsh? Also, what is the availability of these Courier springs like? or are we talking modern repros? Regards, Ian

Hello Paul, The sunroof thing is a bit of a long held prejudice of mine I'm afraid...….I just think that they spoil the look of the car, and introduce the risk of leaks...….so right or wrong I tend to avoid them like the plague. I guess that I'm just going to have to see what cars are available out there...…..it's all very well me being picky, but at the end of the day I'll be constrained by availability/price. Time will tell. Ian

Hello Dave, There is certainly plenty of support for the Mk1 on the Forum, and I'll be interested to see what people have to say on the separate thread I've started specifically about the rear suspension systems on both Mks. The Mk1 does certainly have a more 60s look, although I have to admit that I like both versions aesthetically. Whichever one I go for in the end I know it will be a superb car...…..it's a Vitesse after all!! Regards, Ian

Thanks Doug...….and yes, the Alpine will see the road again...….but I need some classic 'drive time' in the meantime. The Vitesse is a superb car...….so an easy decision really!! Regards, Ian

Thanks Nigel, That's just the sort of information I'm looking for. Regards, Ian

Hello All, As a newbie to the Forum who is currently looking for a Vitesse Saloon I would be very interested in peoples' views and experiences with the differing rear suspension set-ups of the Mk1 and Mk2 iterations of the 2L cars. I have been focused on the purchase of a Mk2 based largely on the horror stories that you read regarding the 'tuck in' issues experienced by the Mk1. However, if owners of both cars could give me their views on this issue, then I would be able to make a more informed opinion. I am particularly interested in what options are available to improve the stock Mk1 arrangement to make it handle better at the limit, and what benefits are delivered by a CV conversion over a standard Rotoflex set up on the Mk2. Any information/views/general abuse gratefully received. Ian

Clive, I'm interested in your comments regarding the improvement of the Mk1 rear suspension set-up, but realise that this thread isn't the right place to discuss it further...…..so I'll raise another thread in the appropriate section of the Forum and perhaps you could go into greater detail? Many thanks, Ian

Hello Pete/Paul, It's obvious that I have a LOT to learn about these cars, and that nothing is as straightforward as it seems. I have done a bit of superficial research, and read about the handling problems that the motoring press at the time aimed at the earlier cars, largely addressed by the Mk2 mods. That being said the problems are probably only likely to manifest themselves at the extremes of driving ……...and as my 'Carlos Fandango' days are way behind me now the likelihood is that it wouldn't be an issue for me. Probably of more significance is the improved cylinder head design...…...isn't the earlier car's head a 'mare' to do gasket swaps and torqueing down on? Something tells me there'll be some Triumph reference books on my Santa list this year!! Regards, Ian

Hello Pete, Thanks for highlighting the Devon car. Yes, I'd spotted it, and it looks in excellent condition, but the asking price is a little high for my budget. I would prefer a Mk2 car if possible, so I suppose I'll have to see if anything pops up in the next few months before widening my search. Regards, Ian

Hello Paul/Clive, Thanks for the replies. Paul...….that is a beautiful car, it just confirms my preference for the Saloon version. I'm out of the UK at the moment, but on my return will join the club formally and submit a 'car wanted' ad as you suggest. I'm keen to source a TSSC member owned car if possible. Clive.....you're right about Richard's car...….it sets a pretty high bench mark eh? Thanks for your advice on the Mk1/Mk2 conundrum...…..and both your and Paul's comment regarding O/D is a useful tip...…..much appreciated. Regards, Ian

Hello All, Have just joined the Forum as a prequel to purchasing my first Triumph. I currently own (and I hope this isn't going to offend anybody's sensibilities) a rather decrepit 1963 Sunbeam Alpine GT in need of a full restoration. My good friend Richard owns an extremely nice Vitesse Mk2 convertible, and his civilizing influence has led me to the conclusion that I need a Vitesse Mk2 in my own life, albeit a saloon in my case. The Alpine will become a long term project (or as Richard will probably suggest...….a rather rusty millstone around my neck!!). Anyway...….very glad to be part of the Forum, which has already impressed me with the quantity and quality of contributions being made. I am actively looking for a Vitesse Mk2 Saloon at present, so would be interested to hear from anyone on the Forum who knows of a good car for sale. I'm after a restored car which has already had any corrosion issues dealt with, but which provides the opportunity for further improvement as a rolling restoration (I already own one basket case......and that's enough!!). I would prefer a car without a sun roof, and with a black interior...…...exterior paint colour is less of an issue, although I have to admit to a weakness for Triumph Damson Red (no-one's perfect right?). I would consider a Vitesse 2L Mk1, but my preference is for the cars with the revised rear suspension arrangement. Perhaps members of the Forum could offer their advice on the comparative merits of the two litre cars?...…..or is that a can of worms best left closed!! Regards, Ian (SixasStandard)