AidanT Posted April 2, 2017 Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hi All, Want your opinion on what has caused and is the issue now with my ignition. on a trip out today the car became very hesitant to accelerate. It ticked over fine and runs at a steady speed OK but when power is needed the car hesitated badly. I got home and the dizzy and points were as per pictures. I have replaced with others, and although the majority of the hesitance has gone there is still some. Its especially obvious if you blip the accelerator when at a standstill. Should i look at timing or could there be an issue with the electronic ignition starting to fail,? what would cause this damage to the dizzy central contact? Just in case you cannot see from the picture the centre contact has burnt down to almost flat with the encircling ring Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 BTW. It's a H&H electronic ignition system Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 2, 2017 Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Looks to me that the sprung contact has not been up against the cap brush , this makes the spark jump the gap and errodes the centre brush and gives the excessive burn you can see do make sure the riveted sprung blade is tight , it the rivet goes loose the sprung contact becomes Significantly misaligned its again poor aftermarket rota quality I reckon if you can measure the height of the rota contact and the depth of the cap it will show theres been a gap Pete pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hi Pete i have now swapped it for one from the club shop, but still there is a slight stutter. The replacement dizzy cap is in good clean condition. I will check the timing next weekend anyway, I have not adjusted it since last year when I adjusted it to stop the pinking when I went down to Somerset. (Do you remember Pete? I asked for your advice then!) I just have not thought to check what i adjusted it to! OOPS) Is there a chance it could just be the electronic ignition failing? In which case I need to get back to H&H Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 2, 2017 Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Aidan. Are you happy with the ignition coil and also the King Lead (KL) between the coil and dizzy head ?? What make are they and how long have you had them on the car ?? I think it would also be worthwhile pulling all the spark plugs out and see if there is any significant colour discrepencies at the tip end. Personally, I feel this is ignition rather than timing. Worth checking all the above to get a better idea of the current health. The KL and coil need to have their resistance checked to see if any breakdown is occurring. Regards. Richard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hi Richard. I will check these out. The leads are luminition blue, so really good quality and have been on since autumn 2014 Plugs are ngk The coil is the original 3ohm No idea on the make age etc but would that be the cause of the symptoms I have? It's not as if it's a problem only when the car is hot Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 2, 2017 Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hello Aidan. If the coil is starting to breakdown it may well cause arcing - they are funny little blighters and have a very odd life style, so can be difficult to know what symptoms they can throw at us before leaving you in the lurch. The rotor arm, from what I can ascertain from the photos, does appear discoloured almost blue and as Pete has pointed out it is certainly bearing the brunt of all things bad at the moment. You have decent plugs and leads - so that's encouraging. I doubt the plugs will be causing the problem as the issue appears coil end not engine end. They may however provide a clue as to a potential issue. It really is going to be a case of step-by-step to identify the problem but that's no bad thing for peace of mind. Excuse my ignorance, but is your car ballast or non ballast ?? Regards. Richard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hi Richard It's a 3ohm coil so non-ballast on the low voltage side. It maybe as well to get a new coil anyway. Always useful to have a spare around if it does not solve the conundrum! I will pull the plugs out and see what they have to say Cheers Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 2, 2017 Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 Just recently there seems a trend in Ngk plugs breaking down at a short life and in patricular when running a bit sooty plugs life and soul of the machine , cheap enough to try a new set but the rotor and cap are stuffed , these you have replaced , the extra gap acts as a spark improver and the plugs may have suffered the earlier pinking wont have helped the plug life do the easy first before you dive into the more difficult deep pocket solutions amd timing static is 10deg. From memory or vac off with a strobe idle under 600 and 29 to 31 at 3000 pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Thanks Pete / Richard. I have some checking to do ???? Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 3, 2017 Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Hello Aidan. I have electronic ignition on the Vitesse and use a Lucas Sports Coil DLB105 - no issues to report and has been in situ fro nearly 3yrs with plenty of mileage clocked up. As with all items these days, source from a decent supplier if you decide to go this route for a replacement coil. Best wishes. Richard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Hi Richard, i was wondering about this so thank you for the recommendation I see the club shop have these (Not sure on the model) so I was going to get one from there. As said previously I think it would be useful to have a spare anyway. i might also do a re-mount to the bulk head while i am at it Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Just to mention, i have just had a reply from H&H, they are happy to send me a new ignition unit to test. I purchased it in August 14, so i think they deserve a very positive mention here! Aidan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 3, 2017 Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Aidan , its the HT arcing between cap and rota thats wrecked them , nothing to do with the electronics, or coils .......... its the gap !!! the spring has to contact the cap brush , no gaps.. on the replacement bend the spring upwards so it has to be loaded against the cap brush.. get that sorted change the plugs and then think about deeper routed components you can set leccy static with a bulb same as with points ,, small pea bulb from coil neg to earth , turn engine slowly and with ign on the bulb will light as soon as its triggered by impulse or mech points both do the same . check the pulley marks as soon as No1 is approaching TDC you want around 8-10deg btdc. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Hi Pete That's my plan and i will check the timing, but as I am purchasing from the club anyway I might as well get a replacement coil, its not exactly expensive! plus will save on postage. I will add plugs to the shopping list! The new cap and rotor have improved the symptoms but not solved them, To my mind that leaves plugs, coil and possibly the electronic ignition. If I have all three to hand and keep my "Claasic Car" fingers crossed, the problem will go Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 3, 2017 Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 There is a Motto...............always do the cheap and easy first after you look at the last thing you touched Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waynebaby Posted April 3, 2017 Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 Aidan, it would be worth checking the height of the spring on the rotor arm. Then tend to come from the supplier too low. Here is the correct dimension: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2017 So I have taken all the plugs out, they are all in very similar condition as per the picture, grey at the spark point with a slight brown tinge but very sooty around the edges. I am not really surprised by the soot as the engine has been warmed up every two weeks over the winter without the cr going anywhere I am kind of happy they are all in the same condition, but could do with a damned good clean up. Ordered some nw from the club today anyhow Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2017 Hi Wayne Sorry unable to read the picture, can you let me know what the dimension is from the top of the plastic to the top of the spring please? Thx Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waynebaby Posted April 4, 2017 Report Share Posted April 4, 2017 Aidan, I don't know why the picture is so small! The measurement is taken from the top of the lower electrode (with the rivet) to the top of the spring.and is 0.30 - 0.35 in (7.6 to 8.9 mm) If you go back a couple of pages in the electrical forum you'll see my post with a picture which is big enough to read. When the spring is high enough you'll find that there is a definite resistance when you fit the distributor cap. I found that this tweak stopped my centre electrode from eroding. Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2017 Thanks Wayne. I will ensure its at the maximum measurement. I'm going to fit New plugs to at the weekend. Hopefully this will solve it. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 4, 2017 Report Share Posted April 4, 2017 Ive now got a area car playing up with no obvious culprits is this contagious pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 5, 2017 Report Share Posted April 5, 2017 Aiden, do make sure the plugs dont have a R in the suffix , that corks up the HT and does cause problems , just had another car in trouble with some R plugs fitted pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidanT Posted April 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 Fitted replacement plugs last night from the club shop ngks out and ngks in. I also bent up the rotor contact to around 9mm Ran the car up to temperature and no hesitation left!!! Still have to take it out on a test run but fingers crossed it was the plugs. The old plugs had been in a couple of years. Is this more mounting evidence of an issue with ngk plugs? Aidan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted April 6, 2017 Report Share Posted April 6, 2017 Maybe, but What were the numbers /spec of the ngk you took out pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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