The embarrassing Herald restoration thread - now the fiddly bits

[Gary Flinn]

I can remember ordering the steel trim pieces and the outer/inner door weather strips from my local BL dealer in the mid 80's for my first Vitesse, a place called Service Motors in Leabrooks, Derbyshire.

It's long gone now, there's a Co-op Supermarket on the site, they call it progress!!

Regards

Gary

[Colin Lindsay]

I assume Andrew Stone of Belper is long gone too, if that's roughly in your area? I remember buying parts from him in pre-Internet days.

[Gary Flinn]

On 13/04/2024 at 12:16, Colin Lindsay said:

I assume Andrew Stone of Belper is long gone too, if that's roughly in your area? I remember buying parts from him in pre-Internet days.

Colin

I believe Andrew moved to France, I actually helped a Mate with the rewire of his premises in Belper in the early 1990's on Derwent Street in Belper, I do currently live quite local to Belper.

I often wonder what happened to John Hills at Redditch, I had loads of stuff off them in the mid 1980's.

Regards

Gary  

 

[68vitesse]

On 10/04/2024 at 21:04, Colin Lindsay said:

I had forgotten the amount of legroom there is in anything other than the convertible, and can actually get my legs under.

Early in the production run of the 2L Vitesse a different seat was used for the convertible to increase the legroom.

Regards

Paul.

[68vitesse]

29 minutes ago, Gary Flinn said:

 often wonder what happened to John Hills at Redditch, I had loads of stuff off them in the mid 1980's.

 

Still useful for reference.

Regards

Paul.

 

[Colin Lindsay]

On 15/04/2024 at 08:46, Gary Flinn said:

Colin

I believe Andrew moved to France, I actually helped a Mate with the rewire of his premises in Belper in the early 1990's on Derwent Street in Belper, I do currently live quite local to Belper.

Gary  

 

As an aside from the dark days on pre-Internet life... I bought an alternator for a Spitfire from Andrew back in 1994, using his ad in The Courier, and sent off a cheque - remember those? Anyway back comes the alternator with a note: "You didn't add VAT, you didn't add postage, so if this arrives with you at all it means Christmas has come early". It arrived. What else could I do? I sent Andrew a Christmas card... in June.

Back to the present day and the Estate is moving along, not without a bit of headscratching. I wanted to complete the interior before fitting the roof, and things get cramped not to mention dark, underneath. I didn't get near the radio, but had one door trim to fit. This is typical Lindsay garage procedure: fit the winder spring in behind, then the red door trim card, then the black bezel, press everything in and slide the winder handle on with one hand whilst using a pair of thin pliers to push the little securing pin into place. That's the theory. In reality the door moves away once any pressure is put on the inside, so put an old pillow against the side of the BMW and wedge the door against that, press the card in, fit the black bezel, fit the winder handle... which doesn't. After a few minutes of puzzlement I realised it's too big for the black bezel. 

                                               

                                               

The nice and shiny one, left / below in the photos, has a wider surround to the square aperture than all my others, so while it may look identical, it doesn't fit. I had to use another and after a little bit of faffing with the little pin got it fitted. I wonder if that one came from a different model?

Now with the interior more or less complete I had to try the roof - not an easy job for one, but I managed to get it into place with no paint damage. At least no NEW paint damage, for despite the ravages of 21 years of storage which have left it very dirty it was originally damaged on the way home from the paint shop in 2003. The Herald went off for a professional two-pack respray, arrived back with me on a dark evening... WHERE'S THE ROOF? It had only been set in place, not bolted down, and had blown off on the way home on the motorway. Amazingly it landed in the rear tub and suffered only slight chipping to the sides and to the top of the screen frame. I'll have to get those touched up now. I couldn't really complain, after all, the painting was free.

                      

The front roof seal caused me a lot of puzzlement as to the orientation, and even more as to how to keep it in place while the roof was being lowered. It jumped out at either end, or lifted in the middle, so with only one clamp of suitable size I glued it in place over two days before trying the roof again. This again caused bother - passenger side in place but the driver's side would not clear the top of the screen surround - at least 1/2 an inch too far forward. I ended up undoing the chassis bolts and jacking up the centre so that it dropped into place. Next problem was the new seal, holding the roof too high at the front. THAT took a lot of coaxing with overlong bolts, drawing in gradually and allowing time to settle. Eventually externally we came up with THIS:

                                                    

Looks all fine and dandy on the outside. Until you look at the outer roof edges. Ignoring the off-centre seal that I'll address at some stage.

                          

Driver's side had quite an overhang, passenger side none at all. Inside the car there was another indication of things not right - with the roof off-centre like that, the hole for the top screw of the rear-view mirror was spot on centre, just a little bit high due to the seal. I loosened off the bolts again, of course the front edge sprung up and played havoc for a bit until I could get it compressed again. I centred the roof by eye, same gap on either side, but on going back inside again, the hole for the mirror is now off-centre.

                                                                               

I think I'll go with the external look and reshape that hole. When trimmed the headlining goes down over that area anyway and round the windscreen aperture, so any surgery will be invisible. speaking of headlining... here's a salutary tale of caution. It seems simple to fit a new headlining with the roof upside down, as it all sits nice and taut. However: when the roof is turned round to fit the car, it all sags worse than one of those people you see flying off for surgery in Turkey. Oops. Terrible looking. I'll tidy up what I can given that parts of the sides are already glued in place.

                                                                              

I hope that once the front is glued in place I can tension some of the rest and take the bad look off it. It started off pristine white back in 2003 but has aged slightly too, so the logical thing would have been to clean it whilst lying flat off the car, not working upside down, but why work in logical sequence anyway. 

Next step is fitting the side windows. For some reason I have four pairs (not to mention SEVEN rear tailgate windows. Where did those all come from???) and on two the seals are actually in quite good condition. I could end up using them with a bit of cleaning and fettling first, not to mention sealer, but as a fall-back I've had new seals stored away for many years (nearly 30) which may be in worse condition. I'm afraid to open the packaging. I also suspect that rather than being one-piece seals I have to cut and piece them, which may not be that easy given the shape of the side windows.            

                                                                 

                                                           

Time will tell. I'm going to sit back for a time now and relax before trying anything else. The local TSSC will be calling en masse on May 11th for a garage tinker day, followed by a short run so I'll crack on with organising that, plus I need to road-test the 13/60 to make sure I at least have a Herald to go in. In typical style I've been lamenting the fact that my hood leaks through a tear on the driver's side, been running about looking for someone who knows how to fit one or else working up the courage to try it myself, and completely forgot the S&D Hardtop hanging on the wall that was rebuilt over lockdown. I suppose as it took three of us to hang it up there and two ladders, I'll not try to take it down by myself. It makes too much sense to use it so I'll just hope for a dry day, if such a thing exists any more.

Edited April 18 by Colin Lindsay
adjusting photographs

[Colin Lindsay]

A bit more progress on the 1200 Estate (15 miles in the 13/60 at the weekend, but that was just to blow cobwebs off. I think the rear spring needs swapping over, it's a bit boaty) and since the roof went on things have flown along. Not that we're any closer to the road but there are so many little jobs to do there's a whole range of things to choose from. I tightened the roof down fully, and even managed to find the huge, very solid washers for the underside of the C-posts. 

Biggest step of the week was to fit the B-post pillars. These, like the sills, have been painted for more than 20 years awaiting refitting, and have (almost) managed to avoid damage since. There's a chip out of the driver's side, but not too visible. I also had a seal / fitting kit salted away, new top and bottom seals and stainless setscrews and washers, Lord only knows where I bought that. It seems to have gone ok so far.

                           

Yes, the door catch does require adjusted but I'll do that as one of the last few jobs once everything else is fitted and tightened down properly. It's amazing how those two pillars complete the car. It's funny but the thing that gave me most pleasure was fitting the small bottom seal.

                                                                            

Still needs fettled a bit, but it's a sort of 'full stop' to the roof fitting, and those masking tape marks will clean off with petrol. They've only been there ten years or so. I also have brand new trims for the inside of the pillars, they're card with a vynide covering to match the headlining, so will require glued and cut to size. Next step will be that rivet - I've none of the proper size - and then the side windows, once I get up the courage to cut the seals and reglue, and the B-post trim has been refitted. It's a big step, measure twice, cut once, still get it wrong, and swear. The cost of replacement seals will no doubt guide my hand. (Speaking of which, I gashed my palm badly on the clip that holds the stiffening rod between the window runners on the passenger door. I scraped it once then went back and did it properly. It bled like a pig and even after a week is still sore. Don't do that again!)

One of the most fun jobs at this stage is finding all the chrome trim, which again has been stored for many years and often has multiple pieces, some of which are scrap, some need fettled slightly regarding dents or scrapes, and some can be used straightaway with just a good clean. The estate pieces are unique to the model, but thankfully I have three or four sets of the larger pieces.

                                                                                   

Part number 6 in the diagram is a covering piece for the joint and I think I have only one of those, but duplicates of all the others. I'll be out buying rivets later so will get some Autosol and give it all a good clean, but keeping it in place may be the problem. All of the clips are long gone or rusted away.      

               

The required items are 610511, 'Clip, beading, side finisher' and 610510 'Clip, beading, finisher top' probably three of the latter and six of the former. The helpful diagram in the catalogue shows what they should look like: item 7 for roof and item 3 for sides. Sadly, this is what mine look like:

                                               

Two roof clips on left and two side clips on right. They seem, in the way of most clips, to hold the trim by sprung tension whilst gripping the paintwork. This means it's not only very difficult to replicate, but the 'grip' is one-sided only, so there's nothing to tension any adhesive against, it will just slip off one side or if it sticks, will be held by one side only so a potential to fall off if any stress is encountered ie from bumps or road vibrations. I also don't want to drill and screw or rivet it as this will be quite obvious on the car. I may send samples of the clips to a few fastener companies to see what they recommend. They may have an equivalent, or other solution.

The corner pieces are at least screwed in place, but here again I'm not happy with the currently available fasteners. The recommended solution is a No8 by 1/2 inch self tapper, notably a panhead pozidrive, which replaces the original YZ3404. I've tried a few as a test and reckon a countersunk or at the very least partial countersunk domed screw looks much better.

  

Of course, once again the problem is going to be locating those particular screws. Chromed might be more difficult than stainless, but that's for tomorrow. I'll browse Spalding and Bresco to see what offerings they have. In the meantime it's Thursday, 9pm, I'm cream crackered so going to crack open a small glass and watch Classic Car Garage to spot more bloopers from my position of lofty moral superiority. Everyone's a critic!

[Josef]

I checked my small collection of misc Stanpart/Unipart bags of clips. No joy I’m afraid. Might be one of those times where calling Fitchetts to see if you get lucky and they’ve got some squirreled away would be worth it. 
Great to see the roof on though!