Roger Posted July 1, 2023 Report Share Posted July 1, 2023 There has been some progress on my Vitesse project and I have finally managed to mate my early HC gearbox with a later 2000 Mk I engine (long story, might become a new post in the future…). Everything looked good so I even planned to go for an MOT test next week (the test is mandatory here on The Åland Island). Breakes are important so just some quick mainenance on them first. I expected to spend an hour or two to clean and adjust them a bit. They did not feel 100% efficient when I drove the car in and out from my garage. It turned out that one cylinder on the rear breaks was leaking. Ok, some more work than planned but it wont take long to fix a leaking cylinder + new hoses! Then the brake hose would not come off, extremely rusty. Finally the brake pipe snapped when I tried to remove the hose. As they say “every half an hour job is just a broken bolt away from a six hour ordeal….”. I try to convince myself that these moments are character building, but at the moment I need some moral support. I have a flaring tool but not sure if I can flare in that limited space and the whole pipe probably should be replaced? Any thoughts? My MOT slot is on Tuesday at 2 PM so a quick fix would be appreciated… Bugger, I was so close to FINALLY drive it again!!! 😫Thanks in advance /Roger. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wagger Posted July 1, 2023 Report Share Posted July 1, 2023 Looks like it may not quite be long enough to rework. Find the other end and remove the whole length. You may be able to reshape it. I have a complete box of new copper pipes, suggest that you aquire some for the future. Very useful in an emergency. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2023 1 hour ago, Wagger said: Find the other end and remove the whole length. Yes, thanks, I noticed on closer inspection that the pipe is only about two feet long. It ends at the other (LH) wheel. I should be able to remove all of it (I assumed it would be a much longer pipe). It seems like the hose on the LH side is almost new, or at least in much better shape. I guess the PO tried to replace both but only managed to do LH side, and gave up on the rusty one on the RH side. I have copper pipe and a flaring tool, so I will try to make a new pipe. If I could only remove the broken pipe first, very tight space. Why cant any job be simple on these cars... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted July 1, 2023 Report Share Posted July 1, 2023 The three way union that that pipe runs to will unbolt from the chassis, that can make it easier to undo the brake pipes from it. Though that’ll involve removing the pipe from the front and the pipe to the other wheel… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 2, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2023 (edited) I did find the three way union, but what a pita it is to get access to it. I managed to undo two of the pipes. The third one that wont move is of course the broken pipe that I want to replace... 🤬 Strange nut that holds the union, never seen that before. I can turn it but I don't have access to the turning end on the other side of the frame. Just another day in the garage... Edited July 2, 2023 by Roger Corrected typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 2, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2023 The good news is that the equivalent pipe that I took of my Herald 13/60 seems to be identical and in good shape. Will try to use that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 2, 2023 Report Share Posted July 2, 2023 hmmm you might struggle to get a seal on pre-used pipe ends as usually on first use they compress down to suit the fitting theyre installed in. I think id prefer to get the old pipe out and IF in good condition cut back and make a new end especially as you have the tool... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted July 2, 2023 Report Share Posted July 2, 2023 get a tube of loctite hydraulic seal a squirt on the flare will seal it for good Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 2, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2023 Thanks, good tip. Will consider making a new pipe using hydraulic seal. However, I'm still three bolts away from removing the old pipe. Been spending the last hours fighting these two. Its a "knurled nut" on the other side of the frame. I can barely touch it with my finger tip (no way to get pliers in there). Why on earth did they put these weird knurled nuts here, or was it PO? It's killing me to lay on the floor, arms up trying to remove those things in that confined space. MOT Test on Tuesday seems far far away... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted July 2, 2023 Report Share Posted July 2, 2023 I’m pretty sure the U.K. standard cars didn’t have any extra fixings on the brake pipe going to the right wheel. Those look more like non factory fittings though. The three way unison should be held to the chassis with a normal nut and bolt. Your photo looks like a nut that’s been a bit abused rather than anything else! The bit of the chassis that it fits to is a U shaped bit of sheet metal, and you should be able to get a spanner underneath to hold the bolt head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted July 3, 2023 Report Share Posted July 3, 2023 Here's mine from the 13/60; it meanders in and out following the contours of the chassis but it's not directly connected to it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 3, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2023 Thanks for the picture Colin, that is what I hope I will be able to produce once I have won the battle against those rustu bolts. Tiny victory tonight: Two more removed, only the one at the three way union left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 3, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2023 On 02/07/2023 at 18:39, Josef said: The three way unison should be held to the chassis with a normal nut and bolt. Your photo looks like a nut that’s been a bit abused rather than anything else! Nope, they are knurled nuts. Never seen anything similar before. This is how they look, I just managed to remove the two that where holding the pipe to the chassis. This is how they look: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted July 3, 2023 Report Share Posted July 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Roger said: Nope, they are knurled nuts. Never seen anything similar before. This is how they look, I just managed to remove the two that where holding the pipe to the chassis. This is how they look: Oh. Interesting. I have seen something like that recently on a video about changing a Seat Leon timing belt. Bigger bolt but the same style. Will they fit a multi point socket? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted July 4, 2023 Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 Those probably have a dedicated socket; on the SAAB and Landrovers I used to own they needed a specific fitting so I bought a set of long sockets that I've never used since on anything else. I have a collection of tools that were bought for one use only and never used for anything else - a 1/4 drive long reach thin wall 15mm socket, anyone? TD5 starter motor top bolt, and nothing else since... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted July 4, 2023 Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 I have several DIY tools for awkward bits on Triumphs eg very ground down thin thin-walled sockets and ring spanners for carb insulator to manifold nuts on a Dolly Sprint, cut out ring spanners for brake pipes, thin 1in AF for J Type solenoid plus numerous modified old ring spanners to get around corners. I have a set of long sockets hadn't used them for eons but were handy a couple of weeks ago to tighten up the brake union thro the bracket on the front turrent, now back in their drawer for another few years! I've always used 1/2in drives but found 3/8 and 1/4 handy recently to get the angle/leverage in tight spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wagger Posted July 4, 2023 Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 15 hours ago, Josef said: Oh. Interesting. I have seen something like that recently on a video about changing a Seat Leon timing belt. Bigger bolt but the same style. Will they fit a multi point socket? Those are splined, not knurled. Count the number of slots. If there are 12, find a close fitting 12 point socket or flat ring spanner. I use a worn one and hammer, or lever, it on. Old BA sizes are not the same at metric (or much else) but finding BA ring spanners, hen's teeth. I have BA, BSW, BSF, A/F and metric sockets. The 2BA is precious. Nothing else coincides with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 4, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 20 hours ago, Josef said: Will they fit a multi point socket? I can't test, I don't own such fancy tools. Yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 4, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 5 hours ago, Wagger said: Those are splined, not knurled English is not my first language, I trust your words 🙂 It sems to be 12 slots. These bolts are strange! Outer diameter is 7,15 mm so quite far away from of 1/4" (6,35 mm) or 5/15" (7,94 mm). It seems to be metric M7 with thread pitch 0,9 mm (or 28 TPI). And they are made of stainless steel! The car was in Sweden for 20 years or so, maybe one of those SAAB things Colin mention above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 4, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 (edited) Well, finally! My son helped me and turned the nut from above while I was lying under the car and held the other side of the bolt from underneath. Time to start to manufacture a new pipe. The shiny one is from my Herald. Edited July 4, 2023 by Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted July 4, 2023 Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 Well done! One of my favourite authors is / was Keith Roberts; in one of his books an old mechanic tells a young one: "It is a thing, a thing that was assembled by man, and as such, it can be disassembled by man'. That has got me through many a dispairing hour in the garage. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 4, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 1 hour ago, Colin Lindsay said: "It is a thing, a thing that was assembled by man, and as such, it can be disassembled by man'. I will remember that quote. What a coincident, I was also thinking about one of my favourite authors when I removed these parts. I love James Herriots vet stories. I have read them many times and I even visted the museum in Thirsk, Yorkshire. One of his books starts with a difficult calving. James lay face down on the cobbled floor in a pool of muck, arm deep inside a straining cow. He has been struggling for hours, and then he feared that the calving could end with embryotomy: passing a wire over the calves neck and sawing the head of. Many calvings ended with the floor strewn with heads, legs and heaps of intestines. Why do I always end up removing a lot more from my car than I first intended? The plan was to replace a break hose and now my desk is full of pipes and rusty parts. Every job on my Vitesse seems to end up in a mechanical embryotomy. But James never gives up, he always describe the beauty of his work and the dales 🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted July 4, 2023 Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 7 minutes ago, Roger said: He has been struggling for hours, and then he feared that the calving could end with embryotomy: passing a wire over the calves neck and sawing the head of. Many calvings ended with the floor strewn with heads, legs and heaps of intestines. That's how I discovered coffee. I was working with a Vet at the time, we ended up sawing the head off the calf, six hours in a freezing cold barn and when we got back to his surgery he only had coffee. Black, no sugar, neither. I've been on the stuff ever since. Keith Roberts wrote from the Corfe area of Dorset, he made the area so alive I ended up making a pilgrimage to Corfe Castle just to see where it was all written. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted July 4, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 Wonderful thread drift here! Going from a broken break pipe on The Åland Island, to vet stories and embryotomy in the Yorkshire dales to Dorset and coffe 😆 This forum is the best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wagger Posted July 4, 2023 Report Share Posted July 4, 2023 2 hours ago, Roger said: Wonderful thread drift here! Going from a broken break pipe on The Åland Island, to vet stories and embryotomy in the Yorkshire dales to Dorset and coffe 😆 This forum is the best Well done and apologies, English is my only language although I sing in Italian and Latin. (No idea what it means most of the time). You have done a grand job. Those bolts look strange in profile, not quite the usual shape for the standard 12 point socket or ring spanner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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