Heavy steering

[mikeyb]

Hello folks,  I'm currently considering buying a TR3/3a and this morning drove one that is for sale in a local dealers.  It's probably 40 years since I owned one, so obviously I have only vague memories of how it drove.  The sample that I tried today had a Rack and Pinion conversion, but I was surprised at how heavy the steering was, even with the standard humungous steering wheel.  Apparently, the tyres had been pumped up prior to my drive, but to what pressure I don't know.  My question is, is heavy steering a characteristic of an R&P conversion, because if so, I would not be happy with that at all.  All comments gratefully received, bye for now, Mike Bambridge.

[Guest]

Hello Mike.

 

Has this car been lying around with zero to negligible use over a significant period of time ??

 

I've got R&P on the Vitesse and even at minimal movement I would say it's not dreadfully heavy and of course with momentum the steering becomes lighter. From your brief it sounds as though the steering is binding.

 

Perhaps the tyres fitted are incorrect with regard to width and ratio; not knowing what the psi was inside is a factor that needs to be considered, but I think if too low you would have probably noticed that. Conversely if over inflated this would cause less rubber surface area to be on the ground making the steering lighter.

 

Maybe the rack is past it's best or perhaps the conversion has been incorrectly fitted with other faults / niggles that have not been addressed correctly. I'm not that knowledgeable about TR3 steering geometry or suspension, could it be a case that the steering ball joints are seized ??  

 

The fact you found the steering heavy with that size wheel really must be an indication that all is not as it should be.

 

I'm sure you have considered the above but just some ideas, if not overly helpful identifying the issue.

 

Good luck.

 

Richard.

[Pete Lewis]

on Rimmers is says  the following the TR3 rack is based on a Mini no clues about the ratio,

  there also quick racks for TR4 > with only 2.5 turns lock to lock  not shown for TR3 

but a supposed quick rack wont be a easy beast as the steering input has to rise by a 3rd 

 

 

 

Product Description

The biggest and most significant improvement to the steering of the TR2, TR3, TR3A models
is the fitment of a steering rack.
This bolt-on kit gives instant improvement with lighter steering for easier parking and driving control.
Due to clearance, the kits should only be used with the 4 blade fan or Kenlowe Cooling Fan Kit.

 

 

 

Product Description

A quick rack for TR4 models has a high ratio pinion giving you lock-to-lock in only 2.5 turns, compared to the standard of 3.5 turns.  Made for competition use, it features a stronger outer casing and a higher grade of steel rack for increased durability.  The rack is designed to be used with standard or solid rack mounts.
Track rod ends and rack mounts are not included.

 

 

[Waynebaby]

Hi Mike,

 

Different car I know, but with similar front suspension (I think) When I got my GT6 it needed two hands yanking on one side of the steering wheel to get the thing to turn at low speeds. The problem turned out to be a nearly seized trunnion. A new trunnion and vertical link restored normal service. I'd try jacking the front wheels off the ground and seeing how easily the steering turns from the wheel end of things.

 

Wayne 

[dougbgt6]

My GT is heavy when stationary, but not two hands on one side! Stationary heavy steering is the nature of the beast. However, if this 3a has the right spec tyres and it's heavy when moving, there's a problem. Could be anything mentioned so far and not forgetting tracking, check for uneven tyre wear.

 

As you are now in your twilight years   the steering may well be too heavy for you.  I bought a Peugeot 306 cheap, because it had no power steering. At first, not a problem, but after 12 years I became conscious I was no longer up to the task and got rid of it!  One of our area members has fitted electric power steering to his Spitfire, this may be the way to go.

[Gully]

Was the steering self- centering? If not, that's probably a good indication of something awry, be that geometry or freedom of movement somewhere.

 

Gully

[mikeyb]

Thanks for all the comments chaps, there are several points mentioned that I have considered but obviously some of the potential problems are not possible to investigate easily on a car that doesn't belong to me.  Richard may have hit the nail on the head as I know for a fact that this car has been sitting in the showroom for several months.  Wayne also mentioned seized trunnions, and as per Richard's suggestion, this sounds a likely issue. Pete's quote from Rimmers blurb clearly indicates that the steering should have been lighter than standard. In my twilight gears Doug !!!!!!!!!! cheeky so and so I'm only 67!  Joking apart......no offence taken, but my present "Triumph" is a JC Midge, Herald 13/60 based with standard non-assisted steering,15"  TR3 wire wheels and 165 section tyres has steering almost as light as that on my wifes modern tin can.  There is obviously something wrong with this car, and unless it proves to be overwhelmingly better than the other cars on my "look at" list, I shall be giving it a miss. Tomorrow I'm off on a trek to see 2 other TR3s, 1 with R&P conversion, the other without.  Will be interesting to compare them.  Thanks again for the advice guys.  Mike.

[mikeyb]

Good question Gully, unfortunately as I'm in my "twilight years" I can't really remember.  I think it did, but wouldn't swear to it.  If I do decide to look at this car again (it;s only 3 miles away so no big deal) I'll make sure to check.  Could also get them to put it on their hoist for a better look.  Cheers, Mike.

[rlubikey]

Mike, you might want to read a thread on the TR Register Forum - Steering, Rack or Standard? where the consensus seems to be that a rack should be lighter and have a more direct feel. But note that not all rack conversions are created the same. I'll leave you to read through. It does sound as though your 3 has a seized component or it hasn't been set up properly.

 

(I had already spotted this thread on the TR forum because the Atlas has a wibbly wobbly steering box and I'm thinking of a DIY rack and pinion conversion, along the lines of the Vee-Dub Type-2 boys.)

 

Cheers, Richard