griffipaul Posted July 17 Report Share Posted July 17 Hi Guys fitting new shocks and springs to Vit mk2. The top mount obviously goes between the 2 bushes but should you fit the two cup washers or not each side of the top plate. I have included them but top bush is very distorted compounded by the fact that the nylon nut is thick and has to be wound down quite a way to engage the locking. So include cup washers or not? Two locking nuts on topmount preferred or is nyloc ok ? Do you need to align the orientation of the bottom mounting to the top plate before fitting spring or will it turn against the spring load afterwards ? Methinks not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted July 17 Report Share Posted July 17 thats looking wrong. yes the bushes will be distorted with the loading but that top washer looks almost flat the cup washer should have a raised protrusion to centre the shaft through the top plate hole pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 17 Report Share Posted July 17 Yes it looks like theres an extra washer in there which doesnt match the design set up like this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissto2015 Posted July 18 Report Share Posted July 18 When I fitted my damperes/springs, I removed the Gaz bushes and washers and replaced with these from Superflex: https://www.superflex.co.uk/proddetail.php?prod=SF375-0201K Then use 4 of these (2 each side): https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-147631 One cup washer goes below the lower bush and the other is above the top bush. You do not need cup washers either side of the top plate becasuet the poly bush moulding already has the correct profile. Finally, I use a pair of half-nuts at the top, rather than a nyloc: https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-NT606041 Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffipaul Posted July 18 Author Report Share Posted July 18 Thanks "krissto2015, that seems sensible to me , one question though do the gaz supplied cup washers not match the polybush profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffipaul Posted July 18 Author Report Share Posted July 18 Or even something like this . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjit Posted July 18 Report Share Posted July 18 That looks more like it from memory, 2 cup washer, well cupping the bush and helping it keep its shape/position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 18 Report Share Posted July 18 Are we sure though for standard bushes the cup washers dont go either side of the top plate as in the pic I posted? I thought the holes in the top plate accepted the cup washers.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffipaul Posted July 18 Author Report Share Posted July 18 That's how I assembled them in the first photo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 18 Report Share Posted July 18 But in your photo there looks to be another washer between the cup and top plate or is that just an optical effect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffipaul Posted July 18 Author Report Share Posted July 18 That's the cup form in the top plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 18 Report Share Posted July 18 Whats the one in your second photo as that looks different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 18 Report Share Posted July 18 ok I can see what you mean in the workshop manual so the second cup washer you have used isnt needed and you might as well put it on top under the nut... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffipaul Posted July 18 Author Report Share Posted July 18 Yes , the cup form locates the bush better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted July 23 Report Share Posted July 23 (edited) I've just seen this post and looked at my GAZ front shock top bushes. As you can see they are not in great shape. I also can't feel the cup that's welded to the top plate?? I don't want to strip down the shocks so I assume I can undo the unlock nut and inspect the top plate without anything 'orrible happening? If there isn't a cup can I use the loose cups top and bottom together with new top bushes? Iain PS. I can see that washer I lost years ago in the top photo 😂 Edited July 23 by Iain T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted July 23 Report Share Posted July 23 whilst the car is on the deck you can undo the shocker top with out any nasty load to bite you . the shocker shaft once out of line can rub against the turret and gives a near untraceable squeaking on road undulations . Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted July 23 Report Share Posted July 23 Thanks Pete, I thought it better to check! Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Foster Posted July 23 Report Share Posted July 23 This is the arrangement on my Konis. Cup washer either side of rubber bush and twin half nuts rather than a nyloc. Ian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted July 23 Report Share Posted July 23 I'll open another Pandora's box tomorrow and post some photo's as to what I find.......🤞 What worries me is how the lower top bush has been fitted. If I jack the front up and take the wheel off I might be able to hopefully see. Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve P Posted July 23 Report Share Posted July 23 1 hour ago, Ian Foster said: This is the arrangement on my Konis. Cup washer either side of rubber bush and twin half nuts rather than a nyloc. Ian That`s the same as the Avo`s on my Vitesse, but due to the angle of the shock, they tend to eat bottom poly bushes so I did a Spherical bearing conversion. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 Sorry to hijack the post. I took both top bushes off today and found an odd fitting arrangement. First off my top plates do have the bush cup 😁. Then came the loose cup, the bush, large washer then nyloc nut. So the loose cup was fitted underneath the bush not on top? I refitted the nearside without the cup at the top as the bush was too deformed to fit inside and used the large thick washer. The offside bush is badly deformed and was fitted the same way as the nearside. However when I came to refit again without using the bottom loose cup and just the thick washer there isn't any thread for the nyloc! Now I know why the offside bush was badly deformed and split! The only way I can assemble is to take 3+mm off the bush. I spoke to GAZ and they said they are a pain to fit but surely if one side is ok the other should be fine? The only thing I can think of is the offside is adjusted around 5mm higher to compensate for the drivers weight. Suggestions please as I was going to get the poly bush which I probably won't be able to fit . Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 I think you need to get the complete units off to see whats going on. There shouldnt be a difference but maybe one damper has been assembled differently under its upper spring pan to the other... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted July 24 Report Share Posted July 24 31 minutes ago, johny said: think you need to get the complete units off to see whats going on. There shouldnt be a difference but maybe one damper has been assembled differently under its upper spring pan to the other... Odderer and oddererer! I went to assemble the troublesome offside and on shoving over the shocker shaft to get it in the centre summit went ping and I have more shaft! The bottom assembly couldn't have been seating correctly? All I know is both sides now assemble ok, although I have reduced the length of the bush to remove all the split parts, and on taking for a short drive it's fine. I checked the seating when I returned and nothings moved 🤞. On visually checking the bottom bushes they seem undistorted not overly compressed. I might still buy the chamfered ends poly bushes which look to locate better but I'll only fit the top bush. However I will check the rear shocks! Iain 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trigolf Posted July 25 Report Share Posted July 25 Hmmm.. I would certainly investigate further. Many years ago I had fitted some Spax front shocks. After a year or so the car kept pulling to the left. I discovered that the shock central spindle was very loose in the top bush and I could move it about! I dismantled the shock/spring and found that the poor quality rubber bushes had worn very quickly and worn the top spring retaining plate central hole oval - which explained the peculiar handling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted July 25 Report Share Posted July 25 2 hours ago, trigolf said: Hmmm.. I would certainly investigate further. Many years ago I had fitted some Spax front shocks. After a year or so the car kept pulling to the left. I discovered that the shock central spindle was very loose in the top bush and I could move it about! I dismantled the shock/spring and found that the poor quality rubber bushes had worn very quickly and worn the top spring retaining plate central hole oval - which explained the peculiar handling Yes I should really strip them down and take a look. The plate hole seems to be ok but it's worrying. I've ordered all the parts from Rimmer and Superflex but I'll wait until I can get some garage space and borrow some spring clamps as I can't do anything where I live. Just fitting the top bush correctly seems to have made the front end better. Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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