Front Hub Felt Seals

[Monty Rustbucket]

Hi all, wondering if anyone can be of assistance.  Whilst changing my brake discs I noticed that I have no felt seals - the ones that fit on the stub axle before the hub assembly.  The car has run like this for years.  Obviously now I know there are none in there I am a bit concerned.  I have 2 new seals but the question is how are they fitted and what way round.  Any pics would be helpful - cheers guys and gals

[Pete Lewis]

The cup fits into the hub with the recess towards the outer so the cup of the seal leaves room to accept the seal within tthe hub , the felt runs inside the cup and up against the stub axle face.

 

dont fit the felt to be inside with the cup over it which would have metal to metal on the stub axle

 

some replacement cups and seals are completely wrong and are too big too thick

 

always recheck thebhub bearing endfloat after a few miles

tighten the castle nut lightly nipped and back off 1 or 2 flats then insert new pin.

 

these must not have any preload or you will seize it very quickly

[Mjit]

Terrible thread abduction I know but as I don't think there's anything to add to Pete's answer to the question...

 

always recheck thebhub bearing endfloat after a few miles
tighten the castle nut lightly nipped and back off 1 or 2 flats then insert new pin.

these must not have any preload or you will seize it very quickly

 

How DO people tighten their castle nuts?  The book says finger tight, then back off till you can get a pin in and that's what I do - but always tend to get advisories at MoT time.  Is this just MoT testers not being used to the Triumph setup as everything tends to be of the pre-load design these days or should I be going tighter, or do I need new bearings?

 

I'm rather paranoid about this because years-ago a friendly MoT station said "The hubs were loose so we tightened them up for you rather than fail the car on it".  I was on the M32 in Bristol when the now over-tightened bearing friction welded it's self to the stub axle leading to the stub axle breaking and meaning it was only the inner bearing and brake disk in the calaper keeping the wheel on!

[Pete Lewis]

if the MOT man has no ideas or clues about the basic designs over the years ,  bearing from cart to road rockets have seriously changed 

 

 

modern fwd cars have a cassette type bearing with two rows of ball or roller  or taper bearings designed to have virtually no end float .and made as a self contained assembly

 

older stuff like triumphs rootes, ford BLMc of the 60 70s used two taper roller bearings  with adjustment by a nut be it castle or later a nyloc type 

 

these bearings  certainly do need to have some float , especially to cope with heat transfer from the brakes,  its unfortunate but the MOT wolly

reduced yours to total destruction,   you should have taken it back and demanded a full repair.

the manual is quite clear 0.002" to 0.008"  ( small chassis , others vary a little) at max. that gives a lot of rock at the rim   upto  like 1/4"   if there is too much you get pad press back where the wobble on the disc presses the pad and piston back and then you get some lost pedal travel on the first application

 

the bearings are a semi loose fit on the stub shafts so the inner cup rotates to spread the wear load around the whole cup,  the rotation will leave a good polished mark on the back of the D washer ..thats quite normal.    if they were tight pressed on you would never remove them 

 

 the bearings in the drive shafts  these are a pressed fit  on the shaft and dont rotate on the shaft but can have the outer rotate in its housing.

 

its supposed to.

 

 

your method of finger spanner nip and back off is perfect

 

Pete

[68vitesse]

Same problem advisories last two mot's just ignored and continued on.

As to felt seals soak them in oil before fitting and squeeze out excess.

 

Regards

 

Pwul

[Clive]

I tighten up gently with a spanner, then back off until I can JUST feel a tiny amount of play.

[AndyTV8]

I have a pair of these waiting to be fitted if a get a numpty MOT tester

 

http://www.triumphspecialtuning.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=40&product_id=87

 

...... Andy

[dougbgt6]

I'm getting too old to waste my time arguing with MOT men so I tighten my wheel nuts before the MOT and slacken them off straight after! 

[Monty Rustbucket]

Thanks for the answer pete - only just read this and already sorted it out but thaanks anyway.  It turns out that the person that owned the car before me put the seals in back to front  which is where the confusion started.  Couldn't see any felt and because of a covering of grease the back of the seal look like it was part of the hub casting.  It was only when I cleaned it that I notice the felt underneath, immediately the penny dropped !!!  Question is do these seals do anything ?  I've never had a need to do any work on this area of the car and so have never really taken any notice of them and I have been running the car with these seals back to front for 14 years and about 50,000 miles

[Pete Lewis]

well they are a seal to stop brake  and road dirt getting in the bearing  rather than stoping grease getting out but the do both quite effectively

 

its a bit worrying with them back to front just what kept the end float 'or not' under control, as the cup can hold the races away from a solid location

on the stub