djn Posted June 9, 2018 Report Share Posted June 9, 2018 Hi, I have been thinking of installing efi in my 2500 spitfire. Looking at the list of parts needed I was thinking of getting the microsquirt kit first and sourcing the other bits and pieces as they become available. Would it be worth while installing the microsquirt kit first just for the ignition control. I currently have a luminition kit installed. Any advice would be very helpfull. Many thanks in advance. DJN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 9, 2018 Report Share Posted June 9, 2018 There probably is some benefit to the microsquirt for ignition only as an interim step. It would give you much better control of the advance curve, which is not stupid given how different modern fuel is from what the factory (didn't) set yours up for. Also, gives you a chance to familiarise with the system before launching into the much harder fuel set-up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 9, 2018 Report Share Posted June 9, 2018 Agreed, mappable ignition is rather good and a big help, though will need though as to how to add 3D (TPS or MAP sensor, the latter probably easier) Also consider if you with to use a singoe throttle body, or a set of six ITB's (again latter the sexier option, but balancing 6 won't be easy. Fabricating an inlet for a single may be a little tricky too, but as it is what 99% of modern cars use, may be a good choice. Power the same, response marginally slower) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 9, 2018 Report Share Posted June 9, 2018 On a six, there's always the completely overkill option of two throttle bodies and a divider flap. Run it as two 3-cyl plenums at low speed, open up to a single one at high speed, to get optimum inlet tuning across the speed range. Was done on the Rover KV6 and the Vauxhall Carlton I6, among others. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted June 9, 2018 Report Share Posted June 9, 2018 I've had a plenum manifold on my Vitesse (2L) for about 13 years now The "how to" is here (it's very old and out of date!) http://www.shadetreegarage.co.uk/Megasquirt1.htm I actually did mine the other way around with the original MS1 ECU being triggered by points for the first year. However, I'd consider fitting distributorless ignition as a first step and using an MS ECU to control it to be a good move. You might want to think about using a full-blown MS2 (or even MS3) ECU though. I say this as the Microsquirt ECU only has 2 dedicated spark outputs which is not enough to run a wasted spark ignition on a 6. I note that they now say that 2 other outputs can be re-purposed for ignition (provided the right firmware version is used) but this means additional components in the wiring loom. The MS2 also requires some modification from standard spec to get three direct spark outputs, but it does all remain packaged inside the ECU. You could also use the Ford EDIS-6 box with either which only needs one spark output but does add to the hardware and wiring. As far as manifolds go, plenum or ITB depends very much on what cam you are planning to run. Until a couple of years ago my engine was near standard internally with the Mk2 cam and it ran really well with the plenum manifold. Now, with a rather more ambitious cam (300º inlet 280º exhaust), it has a slightly ragged idle and some hitching and twitching below 2000 rpm on a sniff of throttle (ie trickling along in traffic territory). It clears immediately more throttle is applied and actually pulls cleanly from <1000rpm but does get wearing when stuck in traffic. It also runs out of puff at 5,500 rpm due to the 54mm TB being too small, though that alone would be easy to fix. The next development (eventually - too many projects, not enough time) is ITBs based on BMW K1100 bike parts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlubikey Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 Presumably, if you had single-point injection (as opposed to just a single throttle body) you don't need a sensor on the cam/distributor, right? Is this part of the set up of Mega/Micro-Squirt 2/3/whatever, telling it what sort of system you have? Cheers, Richard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 12, 2018 Report Share Posted June 12, 2018 It's quite possible to run a multi-point injection system without a cam sensor, it just restricts you to not using "fully sequential" mode. Unless you're doing something clever, which you can on a six with split plenums and (two) manifold pressure sensors. Or if you can tolerate stumbly starts. Single point injection is not a great solution. You're better using multi-point with "banked" or "grouped" ("simultaneous" or "banked" in some people's terminology) patterns. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlubikey Posted June 13, 2018 Report Share Posted June 13, 2018 OK Rob, cheers for that. Richard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moe Posted August 9, 2018 Report Share Posted August 9, 2018 I ran my 1500 with just the ignition side of Megasquirt along with a Ford EDIS ignition system and the original SU carbs for well over a year before adding the injection parts. Made a big difference to the performance of the car, probably more than adding the injection. It is also easier to change one bit at a time in terms of fault finding it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted February 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2019 Finally starting to get a few bits together. Gone for microsquirt and CP pi inlet manifolds. Hope to start fitting in the next few weeks. Interested to hear any advice, especially on bonnet clearance issues and fuel pump stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted May 8, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2019 Finally starting to get a few bits together. Gone for microsquirt and CP pi inlet manifolds. Hope to start fitting in the next few weeks. Interested to hear any advice, especially on bonnet clearance issues and fuel pump stuff. Up and running. A bit of tidying up and tuning to do but running well already. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted August 29, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2019 Hi again, Re Nick Jones post, did you manage to smooth out the issue with lumpy tick over and trickling along in slow moving traffic? My set up has the same issue, fine when cruising but not happy at very low speeds. Fuel consumption improvement similar to yours and pulling well from low down the revs. It has done about 3000 miles since first run with out any issues. I have tinkered slightly with the maps but I don't want to get too far off base. I hope to get on a rolling road sometime in the future but the nearest ones to me are about 200 miles away or so. Currently using a narrow band O2 sensor but considering getting a wide band sensor? Thanks for the various posts and info. DJN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerguzzi Posted August 29, 2019 Report Share Posted August 29, 2019 Hello DJN Are you using Ford Edis ignition? Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted August 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 Hi Roger, Yes, it came with the kit from "Trigger Wheels". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 On 29/08/2019 at 16:51, djn said: Hi again, Re Nick Jones post, did you manage to smooth out the issue with lumpy tick over and trickling along in slow moving traffic? My set up has the same issue, fine when cruising but not happy at very low speeds. Fuel consumption improvement similar to yours and pulling well from low down the revs. It has done about 3000 miles since first run with out any issues. I have tinkered slightly with the maps but I don't want to get too far off base. I hope to get on a rolling road sometime in the future but the nearest ones to me are about 200 miles away or so. Currently using a narrow band O2 sensor but considering getting a wide band sensor? Thanks for the various posts and info. DJN Congrats on getting it working - mildly surprised you got the PI manifolds and fuel rail under the bonnet...... Sorry for the slow answer - I’m a bit occasional on this forum and was in Europe with the Vitesse when you posted. I’ve not messed with mine. The problem lies with the combination of wild cam and plenum manifold. It needs separate throttle bodies to fully sort, but is not so bad I’m motivated to move fast on it. As yours already has separate TBs, and they are very large (46mm), I suspect your issue is throttle balance. This is absolutely critical and very difficult to achieve with the original linkage and impossible if it’s even a little bit knackered. If the balance is not right then different cylinders see different mixtures (fuel is same air is different). The issue reduces as the throttle opening increases which fits your description. The PIs Have exactly the same issue. Oh, buy yourself a wide band, like working in daylight rather than 3/4 darkness! Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted February 16, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2020 Hi Nick, A wide band O2 is on my shopping list so I will have a play around with things once it is fitted. Bonnet clearance is tight but it shuts and so far so good. My throttle body is a 46mm. Thanks for the reply and I will update my progress after I get to the bottom of my noisy back axle area. DJN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrenk Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 Hi djn Talking about lumpy running under 2,000 rpm, I had same problem with Cp TR6 Nd so called 150 cam with single throttle body. It is with a cam that has too much overlap so fitted a cam from early 2.5 pl so called 132 cam after rolling road set up pulls from tick over. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted February 21, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2020 Hi Keith, I think my cam is a standard early TR6 pi cam. Will be fitting a wide band O2 sensor soon and will have another go at set up. No rolling roads anywhere near me but planning a trip to one up in Wick later in the spring to hopefully smooth things out. DJN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted February 22, 2020 Report Share Posted February 22, 2020 Hadn’t realised you have a single throttle..... The TR6 “150” cam does have quite a lot of overlap and consequently doesn’t play nicely with shared inlets (twin SUs, plenum FI) due to reversion. Should be possible to get it fairly ok (will likely need to be quite rich in the problem area) but will always be a bit fussy at low rpm and light throttle. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djn Posted February 27, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2020 Thanks for the reply Nick. Will let you know how I get on once I get the wide band fitted and the roads get cleaned of salt. DJN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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