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Helicoil inserts on thermostat housing - any problems?


Colin Lindsay

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I've traced a coolant loss on the TR7 engine to the thermostat housing; it was weeping out around the thermostat cover. On checking I've found no threads at all on one side of the housing, with the other not great either, so nothing to hold the bolts in bar a fairly tenuous grip. I've bought two new setscrews which are 5/15 UNC, one 1" and one 1.5", which if anything grip worse than the originals and one is even longer by quite an amount.

The thermostat housing on the 2.0 litre engine is an integral part of the inlet manifold. SO: bar getting an entire inlet manifold in better condition, can I helicoil this? I take it the fact that it's alloy won't make any difference, or is there a particular helicoil I should use?

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DSCF5814.jpg.a4d04e34c9da7def1385e1883e88608e.jpg

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Helicoil away! Ideal in ali. 

I have just helicoiled my TR7 head for the exhaust  manifold bolts. But being a philistine I used metric (I don't have any imperial helicoils, only metric were available locally when I needed them in an emergency. And being that they are often needed in an emergency, I have never had the foresight to order up imperial sizes.

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Thanks Clive and Tony; I've never helicoiled in my life so it'll be a new experience. What length do the inserts come in ie do you use two for longer screws? 

One concern I have is getting the larger hole drilled at the right angle; I don't want to take the manifold off if I can help it so it will have to be drilled on the car.

This is obviously the reason why the old screws were so hard to remove; you can see the remains of the Araldite on the threads...

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Helicoil in alloy material is stronger than the original. they come in lengths that are a multiple of the diameter eg. 0.5D, 1.0D, 2.0D etc. The key is getting the insert in straight - seen Mini gearbox drain plugs helicoil (which are 5/8 UNC) done on the wonk, and it always leaks a little like that!

Having been faced with a mixture of the correct unified fasteners, unified fasteners with metric heads!! (why?); and metric fittings - I'm always keen to replace like for like and keep a selection of thread repair kits to get me out of trouble.

If you're going to buy something in, UNC and UNF kits are not expensive.

https://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=22020

If you're really faced with a BIG repair the EZ LOK Inserts are available here; but they're more expensive:-

Carbon Steel:

https://www.amafasteners.co.uk/product/319-5

Stainless:

https://www.amafasteners.co.uk/product/303-5

 

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My tip of the day is to drill the hole dead carefully, not hard, just take care and don't drill down too fast, the ali can grab the drill and snap it. Then a bit of WD40 on the tap, and turn it half a turn or so in until it bites, and back off, keep doing that to clear the swarf. Then ideally a blow gun to clear it out once done. However, I then run the tap up and down the thread a couple more tomes. I didn't used to, and found the inserts were too tight. Then wind the helicoil in,and break the tang off. 

I used 1D length on the manifold (ie 10mm bolt, the coil was 10mm long) and they hold very well. Many are 1.5d which may suit it better? and I guess shorter/longer are available. But don't worry, just one, get is a little below the surface and and it will be fine.

And the nlet is a PAIN. Chap helping me at the weekend popped teh gasket on back to front, assembled up, then noticed leak from a drilling that is blanked by the gasket. And then there is the bolt at the front, difficult to get to so used a 1/4" wobble bar, luckily it came out OK. And the bypass tube.... 

Anyway, if you can avoid taking it off you will have a much happier day. 

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Thanks for all your help and advice, as usual I'm planning ahead and the reality, when I try it will probably be simple enough. This is my version of measure twice, cut once! Biggest concern is keeping the drill straight for the initial drill-out.

I've ordered a Helicoil-style kit - I need the tools that come with it, anyway - and once I have the full kit any other inserts I need will be cheaper. I just don't want to banjax the entire fitting then have to replace a full manifold for the sake of two bolts. I suspect the end of the original bolt is broken off in the hole, but can't see it when I shine a light down; however the new bolt is longer than the original. I think I'll take Clive's advice and use a shorter length; in the stainless inserts it should grip better than the alloy. 

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Don't worry about it. If you can drill a hole you can drill a hole. It will sort of self centre a bit anyway, if I can manage it, you will.

Are you sure the bolt is broken? apoke with a bit of stiffwire should give you an idea if anything is left in there. The tap is a bit tapered, so needs to go much further in than he insert. If there is a bit of bolt stopping things, that may be an issue.

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IIRC it was a mouthful, how times change. How did we get on to discussing chocolate anyway?

I've had to take the entire manifold assembly out of the car to put it on a pillar drill, just to get things perfectly straight, but everyone I've spoken to including those sterling gentlemen at Robsport have confirmed that helicoils are stronger than the original threads and will last a lifetime once inserted.

In any case half of the engine is now removed, so if I get as far as replacing the thermostat housing I'll be on the home stretch. 

 

 

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can always go bigger, even go metric coarse.

OR, get some  aally typerodsthat melt wid a blow lamp,

they melt befoer the parent metal, hard an as strong as the original stuff

it really is as simple as this couple of  clips shows

 

 

thees ar,t rods, ive done loadsa stuff wid em, they v v good.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=alloy+brazing+rods&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=+low+temp+alloy++welding+rods&_sacat=0

 

 Or,  Ye need some of thee,s bolts,

very handy things they are,!!!

pacific_fasteners_7877.jpg

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1 hour ago, GT6M said:

can always go bigger, even go metric coarse.

 

Yes, went to the father-in-law at his engineering company to see if he'll drill the holes for the helicoils, (I needed a jig or clamp as I can't get it held securely enough at the correct angle for the drill) and he simply asked why I hadn't used bigger screws...

I suppose the real reason is that I've never had to use helicoils so want to try them.

I love some of those bolts....   :)

 

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