The embarrassing Herald restoration thread - she no go!

[rlubikey]

18 hours ago, Pete Lewis said:

thats an illuminating story      

Pete

You mean, Collin's project is, ahem, "Glowing Well"?

I'll get my coat...

Cheers, Richard

[Chris A]

1 hour ago, rlubikey said:

You mean, Collin's project is, ahem, "Glowing Well"?

I'll get my coat...

Cheers, Richard

Yes, he's making light work of it . . .

[Graham C]

He just lights up the room

Graham

[Colin Lindsay]

Love the comments, guys, I'm a bit of a narcissus or whatever that plant is. In any case the Herald is now behaving and I can mark the electrics as complete so off the 'to-do' list.

                              

What do you mean 'no side lights' ????? That was just a dislodged connection at the front of the bonnet, one bullet connector squeezed together later and on they came. Simples! If only everything else was as simple.

First major step was replacing the broken oil pump; in a way that was a blessing as I was able to examine the pump, which has been in the engine for years and was replaced when the engine was rebuilt. I did think maybe that was corner-cutting, as a new one would maybe be better, but as has been commented I've read the scare stories of the new reproduction pumps and decided that the original might be better. The tests showed everything still well within tolerances, so why not? Well, metal fatigue for one thing. I decided to check around suppliers and found a guy selling uprated and modified pumps under the name 'Shacktune' which came highly recommended, so as it was only about £40 more expensive than an unknown quantity of repro pump, I decided the outlay may be worth it.

                                                                      .

Pump arrived, looking great, although a 'strainer' type intake rather than the long straight pipe of the Herald pump. Still, no big deal as long as it works. Aha! There's the rub! In order to work it has to fit, and this pump didn't. The body is much bigger than the measly 1147 pump and consequently hit against the central crank bearing housing, and wouldn't slide into place without gentle force and a bit of abrasion which seemed to me to be pushing it off-centre.

                                     

I just couldn't take the chance, not with oil, in a newly rebuilt engine. I'd have liked the extra flow, plus the knowledge that it was all new and free from age-related defects, but by the time the sump is back on and the engine running it's a bit to late to find that that little bit of misfit is causing problems that only become apparent when the green engine oil light comes on. It may have been my fault - after all I'm under the car working upwards - but it just didn't seem to seat to my satisfaction and having broken one I was not going to break another. The ad says Mk2 Spitfire which is 1147, but unless there are smaller bearings or other block changes that I'm unaware of it won't fit my 1147 Herald engine. 

Best solution then was to take a spare pump from an idle engine and use that. Easily done, just unbolt the sump from a spare block and remove the pump, which may have sat idle for the last four years or so - maybe more than that - but actually looks to be in better condition that the one I was intending to use. Broken pump on left, replacement on right below.

                                

That one has now been cleaned up and refitted; the marks on the face are just from the cleaning cloth and not in the actual metal. A lot cleaner and a lot shinier, so in it goes after a quick smoothover with a sheet of glass. I've since primed it and refitted the distributor drive once TDC was worked out, and again in the dark distant past I've put timing marks on the pulley as the Heralds don't actually have any, just a hole in the actual pulley, so i'd like to think that the timing is close if not spot-on.  

The sump was also a headscratcher; my Estate engine is a GA232 or thereabouts, and the spare engine from which the pump was taken is a GA161, so a few years between them. Triumph cost-cutting is evident in later production, and the early sump has this lovely strainer inside, set into a metal 'floor' through which the pump intake fits.

 

The later sumps are just a simple metal bowl with no innards. I was tempted to use the earlier sump but again, as with the oil pump, I can't guarantee that things haven't changed inside the block so that when the engine starts up, there'll be a few rattles and bangs as metal meets metal. I'll just have to go with the later sump, new gasket and plenty of sealant to ensure that there's no oil leakage - the estate engine does tend to drop a lot and that's not even running yet, and I still suspect the threads on the drain aperture which none of my numerous drain plugs seal against sufficiently to stop drips. Pump and sump are now back in place, TDC determined, distributor cap and leads back on, but no startup. Smoke coming from the carb, one slight pop on cranking, but no start. There's a spark at the plugs so I suspect fuel; pump seems okay, maybe not 100% so worth a check later on but for now, strip the carb down and inspect.

Now, first inspection:

                                                                    

That's where the float valve sits. The metal is a thread from the alloy housing that has been stripped in the past, before being recut by me, but obviously not cleaned out very well. I've now cleaned out all the jets and float chamber, but need a replacement gasket before rebuilding. I've no idea how much that sliver affected the running but obviously can't startup again until the Postman brings the gaskets. Lucky thing, too; I happened to look at the top radiator hose whilst working on the ignition leads. This is a Kevlar-reinforced hose, bought by me around 2020 and fitted to the engine just last year. Antifreeze has been in the system but it's never been started. Seriously cracked and split, at both ends, and worse when squeezed.

  

Luckily I saw that and luckily I have a new hose, bought only last week to make up the numbers of a parcel that was going to cost postage up to a certain weight, so may as well fill it with assorted service parts. The new hose is a Bastuck brand and hopefully longer-lasting.

I had to MOT one of the moderns during the week, so rolled the Herald out into the light of day to get access to the ramp. It looks well, especially since I polished it. Here's a tip: never lift a rotating polisher off a car while it's still rotating. Clothes, walls, paintwork, tools... all covered in polish splatters. At least they'll not rust.

                                                        

We are looking very well, though, despite the lack of sills and wheeltrims. The sills will be the last piece of the puzzle, a sort of full stop along with the bumper ends, and as for wheel trims, I know I have a few stored away. The estate used the slot-type trim, as opposed to the round style of the saloon or convertible and the same as the GT6 Mk1, so I knew I had a few. more than a few, in fact.

              

I actually have eight full sets, including an aftermarket set, one saloon set, and six Estate sets, some of which are original Stanpart. As with hub caps, these used to appear on eBay for pennies back in the day, so were all picked up very cheaply, and I have five sets of NOS hubcaps as well none of which cost me more that £20. Not that I like to boast but if you've got 'em, flaunt 'em. I once took my Gt6 for MOT and on the way, one of the hubcaps overtook me like a frisbee. I never found it, either. When I got home I found another missing from the opposite side, so bought a few spares as they came up for sale. It becomes a habit... which is why I have about ten 948 or 1200 speedos too, I like them and they only cost about a fiver, even the NOS ones if you look hard enough. I also had a habit of mangling the trims everytime I had to take a wheel off, so again it was handy to buy a few spares. I just never realised how many!

My friend's 1200 convertible is also coming along nicely; the bodytub I gave  him is now blasted, welded, and in primer waiting for the green top coat. It's a lot of very dusty preparation but will be worth it in the end. I never want to see 1200 wet and dry ever again. I never thought that the tub would turn out so well, but it cleaned up amazingly and with the unsightly welding repaired or tidied up it has come on in leaps and bounds. It's not going to be a Triumph Green, but it's his car and he picked the colour. He also wants - covets! - a tan interior but mine is staying put in my convertible. It will be nice to have another one on the road so must plan a few outings.

  

And as they used to say on Tales of the Riverbank: there we must leave them. Or was that the Woodentops? Until next time...

 

 

 

 

[Pete Lewis]

too much stuff    in   store 

sorry on 3 glasses of rum  following a court case with grotty daughter 

success today so the bottle   of rm got hammered         Hic 

and a  post code lotterty win      followed by a rainbow          over the house 

where is the pot  of gold then

Peter

Edited September 12 by Pete Lewis

[iana]

Colin, just picking up on your post re the trims, which is correct for the 13/60 estate, I thought it was the holes rather than slots but were deeper as he wheel size is different on an estate

[Colin Lindsay]

19 hours ago, iana said:

Colin, just picking up on your post re the trims, which is correct for the 13/60 estate, I thought it was the holes rather than slots but were deeper as the wheel size is different on an estate

Entirely possible!! The earlier estates had a 3.5J HD wheel, but what exactly made it HD I've never found out - maybe just thicker metal or smaller 'slots' and maybe this became for all of the 'narrow slot' wheels on later cars. Many of the early 1200 photos show no trims at all. Later cars, and we're probably talking 13/60, had the slotted trims on 4.5J wheels, same version - as far as I know - as fitted to the GT6 MK1. Of course the Internet is full of photos of all sorts of cars wearing all sorts of trims, but I'll just go with the type I have plenty of. It's never going to be concours-exact, just look shiny. I only found out two days ago that my 13/60 convertible has three of one type, one of another...

[iana]

I’m just debating selling my Vitesse and spending some of the money on the herald estate and getting it restored and generally tidied up or selling the estate (the estate attracts more attention at the shows, it’s more practical and easier to drive but then there’s the straight six sound track of the Vitesse). If I go the route of keeping the estate I’m sure I will have loads of questions

[Colin Lindsay]

On 21/09/2024 at 18:37, iana said:

I’m just debating selling my Vitesse and spending some of the money on the herald estate and getting it restored and generally tidied up or selling the estate (the estate attracts more attention at the shows, it’s more practical and easier to drive but then there’s the straight six sound track of the Vitesse). If I go the route of keeping the estate I’m sure I will have loads of questions

My Herald-restoring mate The Minister (of God, that is) regularly breaks his commandments by coveting both my Estate and my tan interior in the 13/60. If I ever see a post anywhere along the lines of "Will God forgive me for killing a friend and taking his car seats?" I'm out of here. He just loves the shape of the Estate and I must agree with him!

 

 

[Colin Lindsay]

Well, not much further on than before. Had a seriously bad dose of flu, fit for nothing, so wandered about as strength permitted and fiddled with silly things on the bench. Now fully recovered and still doing nothing sensible.

Biggest problem is that the Estate engine will not start. Not even a cheap. I rebuilt the Solex carb, refitted it, and cranked the engine - nothing. Sparks to all plugs but no life in the engine at all, and fuel started to drip from the Solex fuel pipe, so off it came again. I replaced the top cover with a new seal, just in case the threads weren't sealing, but same problem - no life in the engine and fuel leaking at the pipe. I replaced the entire carb with a spare; still nothing. Out came a THIRD carb, rebuilt, stripped down and all the jets and pipes cleaned out, had to buy two more gaskets, cleaned the copper float nicely, reassembled, and cranked the engine again. More fuel leaking at the inlet so tightened as much as I dared, but nothing at the engine. The fuel is not getting into the manifold / chambers.

                            

Three different carbs and the same problem. That should tell me that it's NOT the carb. Surely the valves can't be so bad that they're all stopping fuel getting in? No. Just thinking out loud as usual but that can't be it. When I dismantle the carbs the float chamber is full of fuel, and it's fresh enough stuff, but not even a puff of smoke from the engine no matter what configuration of leads I try, just in case it's way out. I've left it for now and moved on to other things.

I mentioned elsewhere that I was debating adapting old pre-focus headlamps rather than using sealed-beam units, and I'm happy to say that they're a success. Bulbs in the BRB fitting are readily available, and in both halogen and led form, so it was just a matter of cleaning out the light units - photo shows the original glow-worm bulb still working away.

                

The halogens are a straight fit, and once I confirmed that the dip and beam patterns were UK legal (the bulbs arrived marked 'motorcycle') I was able to fit them both and test the result.

                                                                          

I'm happy to report they are amazing, as good as any modern halogen upgrade, but with the traditional period look. The only fly in the ointment is that i have three, one with pilot light, and of the other non-pilot pair one has lost two of the three fixing lugs over time. Without those it won't sit properly in the backing bowl. I went online and found a replacement - happy days, only £19 NOS - then when it arrived I realised it was a different bulb fitting. My fault for not studying the photos! I may make up the little metal lugs myself and glue them in place, or else hold out for another new globe in the proper style, but in any case I'm not tied down to complete sealed beams any more, as they're getting scarcer and more expensive to replace.

I may - only time will tell - have located the source of the oil leak from the 13/60. It leaked an entire pool on the Saturday TSSC run, didn't leak at all on Sunday in the garage, but on Monday we had an interesting pattern underneath.

                                                     

Front was left, so first dot or maybe both smaller ones are timing chain area, but the larger dots and all those other dark ones to the right are from the bottom of the engine and literally mark out the shape of the sump, right round. The larger lighter patch to the extreme right is gearbox, from the overdrive filter plate. I've refitted and resealed the sump and checked the front and rear plates, to no avail, but last week I had a look at the alloy rocker cover which is held on by two of those chrome domed bolts. They were both amazingly loose. The rocker cover did not move when pressed, but I suspect that when the car runs it may move up under pressure and allow the oil to leak literally all round. I've added locking washers under the bolts and will monitor. 

I'm being seriously messed about by Quickfit Seatbelts at present, the novelty is wearing off and I may try elsewhere. All I want are two sets of Herald seatbelts, one convertible with the two-bolt b-post bracket and side tunnel connections, and the estate with the single bolt wing fitting NOT the two bolt bracket of saloons.

I've edited out a lot of the gory details but I'm dealing with people who when I phone to order belts have one ear on the phone and one ear God knows where, are always talking to people off the phone and interrupting my order, in meetings or in the car so can't talk, "phone us back later", but no time for me as a customer. Ye Gods above, I'm a CUSTOMER trying to spend money and order a product and it should not be this difficult. Why should I do all the running and persuasion and return phone calls? I'll try again tomorrow but I just know that with my luck I'll end up with incorrect belts and an entire rigmarole trying to get them corrected. Please, just take my money and give me the belts.

On a final note my mate's green Herald is progressing; as Eric Morecambe would say: all the right parts but not necessarily in the right order. It was jumping the gun a bit to fit the front overriders and seals with the bonnet sitting elsewhere, but the tub is STILL not bolted to the chassis and I don't know if he has doors, where they are, or how they fit. 

                                                                

He still wants a tan interior but credit card says no. It's a lovely colour but I worry that a lot of it is going to come off once the adjustment starts. At least he hasn't mentioned seatbelts.

Edited 7 hours ago by Colin Lindsay
Removal of personal details