poppyman Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 2 hours ago, Colin Lindsay said: Ever put a 5p in behind someone's wheel trim? They'll go mad looking for the source of the rattling tinny noise... until finally they take the wheel off... Connect the horn to an indicator with a couple of scotch locks or earth the oil light switch when they are not looking....... Great fun when they have just done an oil and filter change. Tony. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 Does anyone have an appropriate alternator bracket from a iron block spitfire that they're prepared to sell? There's only one on E-Bay at the moment, but that already has a welded repair, so not ideal. Thanks, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 on my Vit6 1600 we used the dynamo brkt. just modified the threaded boss to correct the stand off and a spacer to take up the length of the rear sliding bush if the tail lug has a bush its important its allowed to be mmoveable not fixed solid or the lug will soon fracture off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 1 hour ago, Pete Lewis said: on my Vit6 1600 we used the dynamo brkt. just modified the threaded boss to correct the stand off and a spacer to take up the length of the rear sliding bush if the tail lug has a bush its important its allowed to be mmoveable not fixed solid or the lug will soon fracture off. Hello Pete, Any chance of getting some close up pictures of the bracket to give more of an idea of the mods required? Great tip about the rear lug by the way. I have an alternator in the shed that was intended for my Alpine but I'm now thinking of using for the Vitesse. It was bought a couple of years ago and is reputed to be for a late 1980s Ford XR3i (pictures attached). There are ZERO markings on the casing to identify it more accurately, but there is an outfit in Salford that punts these units out on E-Bay and mine looks identical: https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiP4aX9iKLpAhXIUMAKHUxqC2EQFjABegQIAhAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fitm%2FFits-FORD-Escort-1-6-XR3i-Alternator-1986-1990-1704UK-%2F361618526451&usg=AOvVaw2QxtfgFZEv2X_7QIGl3c5F If it is the same then it's a 75amp unit. It does have a bush in the rear lug, so the tip regarding not locking it down on that rear bush is really helpful, thank you. I suppose the 75amp output means that I need to be careful about the spec of the cable back to the battery? Also......interesting to see that your Vitesse has the bulkhead below the waistline in black........my car is also white and I was considering a similar move, as the current paint job (not the best) has reacted in this area and is peeling off.......so with a jumbo tin of Hammerite kicking it heels in the shed it seems like a good option. Regards, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
68vitesse Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 1 hour ago, SixasStandard said: Does anyone have an appropriate alternator bracket from a iron block spitfire that they're prepared to sell? There's only one on E-Bay at the moment, but that already has a welded repair, so not ideal. Thanks, Ian Any iron block one will do Triumph 1500, Toledo etc. Regards Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 Are the 6 cylinder and the 4 cylinder versions the same? Can't remember, too lazy to run out and look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 sorry no other snaps of the mount i am sure all we did was reduce the length of the front hex screw in boss the tail just used bushes to make up the shorter alt length . the alternator was a lucas 80 amp fits all universal rescued from the obsolete parts skip just hard wired it direct to the solenoid to battery terminal dumped the old wiring to control box etc. sorry car sold 5 yrs ago not seen it since just tried to magnify but ...failed Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 Ok so dived out to the garage yet again and found two; I think(!) the smaller one is four cylinder; the bigger lightweight version is definitely 6 cylinder and hangs lower on the block. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 One that hangs down is Mk3 GT6, to drop alternator below bonnet line. Have been very expensive in ,the past, that one being an aftermarket replacement. the nice shines alternator above is an A127 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 50 minutes ago, thescrapman said: One that hangs down is Mk3 GT6, to drop alternator below bonnet line. Have been very expensive in ,the past, that one being an aftermarket replacement. the nice shines alternator above is an A127 Thanks for identifying the alternator, do you think it would be a good choice for the Vitesse? Also, should I be taking the extra cable required back to the starter solenoid or direct to the positive on the battery? There's a wide selection of alternator to starter/battery cables on E-Bay from various modern cars, so that would seem the best route to source one......any thoughts? Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted May 7, 2020 Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 The alternator will work fine. Extra cable, have a measure of what you need would be my advice. You won't need it to be battery/starter motor sized though. The alternator will be 35-40A at a guess, so you need cable that can cope with about 30A as your existing cable will take about 25A. So 4mm2 cable (whatever that translates to) will be plenty. And just a crimped eye at each end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2020 Thanks Clive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 15 hours ago, thescrapman said: One that hangs down is Mk3 GT6, to drop alternator below bonnet line. Have been very expensive in ,the past, that one being an aftermarket replacement. That ones for all GT6, not just Mk3, but it was bought as a lightweight at some show or other and never fitted; I've the original heavy version fitted to the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave.vitesse Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 As interest the 2 Litre Vitesse models had a drop down dynamo mounting. (With an alternator option). Vit6 had the upper mounting dynamo type. I though the Mk1 GT6 had the same dynamo set-up as the 2 Litre Vitesse ? As said the drop down type GT6 alternator mount is very rare. Colin's got them all Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 22 hours ago, clive said: The alternator will work fine. Extra cable, have a measure of what you need would be my advice. You won't need it to be battery/starter motor sized though. The alternator will be 35-40A at a guess, so you need cable that can cope with about 30A as your existing cable will take about 25A. So 4mm2 cable (whatever that translates to) will be plenty. And just a crimped eye at each end. Hello Clive, After reviewing the information provided via the Forum, and with additional information from the Web, I now have a pretty detailed set of plans to complete this conversion. The one thing that I still need clarification on (and forgive me if I'm being dense here) is whether I should be taking an additional cable from the alternator output to either the starter solenoid positive terminal, or else direct to the battery positive terminal? Common sense says that the battery would be easier and cheaper, as it is physically closer and you'd need less cable, but just about every reference article I have found on the web says to take the cable to the starter solenoid. Could you (or anyone else out there) confirm one way or the other please? Thanks, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 starter sol +ve and battery +ve both the same ,just its supposed to be easier to fit a cable eyelet to the solenoid terminal stud than a battery terminal clamp Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 40 minutes ago, SixasStandard said: Hello Clive, After reviewing the information provided via the Forum, and with additional information from the Web, I now have a pretty detailed set of plans to complete this conversion. The one thing that I still need clarification on (and forgive me if I'm being dense here) is whether I should be taking an additional cable from the alternator output to either the starter solenoid positive terminal, or else direct to the battery positive terminal? Common sense says that the battery would be easier and cheaper, as it is physically closer and you'd need less cable, but just about every reference article I have found on the web says to take the cable to the starter solenoid. Could you (or anyone else out there) confirm one way or the other please? Thanks, Ian Either is fine, as the solenoid connection is also connected to the battery. It may be preferred as it is a more simple [place to connect to? But I have always gone straight to the battery. So I have not helped at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted May 8, 2020 Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 One useful thing with the A127 is that there are 2 outputs on the back, both the spade and the threaded stud are common inside, so run additional wire off the stud to the battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2020 Thanks guys, that's the final question answered........now it's time for the spanners!! Regards, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted May 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 Hello Guys, Just thought I'd update this thread with my progress, just in case someone else is currently considering changing from a dynamo to an alternator, and wanted to see the specific changes that I've made to my car. To summarise.......I have chosen to retain the Lucas RB340 Voltage Regulator Control Box, but use it as a junction box. First thing was to dig out a spare RB340 from my shed and remove the 3 bobbins inside the box by drilling out the rivets on the base plate and using a punch to force them out. Whilst I had the drill handy I also carefully drilled the rivets holding the 'L' shaped connection on the 'WL' terminal to the larger 'D' terminal, don't overdo the drilling......just enough to be able to pry the 'WL' terminal off, then you can peen the remainder of the rivets over to keep the 'D' terminal securely in place. Don't discard the 'WL' terminal, I cut it down, drilled it and then fixed it to the 'F' terminal using a nut and bolt through the hole left by the removed bobbin rivet. This now allows you to connect the 'WL' and 'F' simply by pushing on the original cables without any cutting or soldering. By not butchering the loom you leave the option for any subsequent owner to easily return to a standard dynamo configuration by simply installing another RB340 unit. I then drilled out the rivet securing the 'E' terminal and removed it, as this is no longer required. Find a small bolt that can fit through the hole left by the removed bobbin rivet on the 'D' terminal, and secure it with a nut and washer on the inside face of the base plate. The 'B' terminal is a double, and is connected to a post inside the box which has a breaker contact on one face. File the breaker off to create a simple terminal post. I salvaged a suitable piece of heavy gauge brown coded cable from a scrap loom which already had a large Lucar connector on it, I cut this to length and crimped on a spade connector to the other end. All that was needed to complete the job was to push on the Lucar connector to the 'B' terminal post and connect the spade to the nut and bolt from the 'D' terminal. The pictures below will explain all of the above!! Regards, Ian 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted June 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 Hello All, The alternator project is still ongoing, and my question now relates to the specific connections required for my particular incarnation of the A127 alternator. I've attached a photo with explanatory notes, but to summarise.........I have a thick Brown/Yellow wire and a thin Brown/Red wire that were previously connected to the dynamo...........so I'm assuming that the Brown/Yellow is the battery cable and needs to be connected to the 'B+" post on the alternator together with the additional 110 amp rated cable that I've bought to go back to the battery positive terminal (to make allowance for the additional amps produced by the 75 amp alternator). The thin Brown/Red wire should be the ignition warning light connection, so should go on the smaller 'D' post, while the 'W' post for the phase connection doesn't need anything as the car hasn't got an electronic tacho. If all of this is ok so far (???) then my final question relates to the spade connection alongside the 'B+' which I think is for a suppression capacitor. My alternator didn't come with this suppression capacitor, so I'm wondering if it's needed for my particular application or not? I'm sure that there are plenty of you out there that have come across this issue before, so hopefully someone can confirm my understanding of the required connections as outlined above, and answer the question regarding the suppression capacitor. Thanks for any assistance/advice. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 You only need one new wire from B+ to the batt positive the old brown yellow charging line wires to regulator and subsequently back the the solenoid battery link can be removed if you connect the two small lucars (not the black ) on the control box together you can use the exisiting warning light harness but the old charge wires are best defucnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted June 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 6 minutes ago, Pete Lewis said: You only need one new wire from B+ to the batt positive the old brown yellow charging line wires to regulator and subsequently back the the solenoid battery link can be removed if you connect the two small lucars (not the black ) on the control box together you can use the exisiting warning light harness but the old charge wires are best defucnt Hello Pete, Thanks for the reply. Although I'm converting to an Alternator I'm conscious that any future owner might want to revert the charging system back to original spec, so I've retained the Dynamo and original unadulterated Regulator box in my parts cache (to pass on with the car), and kept the wiring loom stock. The mods I've made to the new RB340 were specifically designed to allow the existing loom connections to be kept OE, without any cutting and soldering, whilst still making the new connections required for the Alternator. With that in mind, is there any specific reason that I need to remove the old charging line wires? I take your point about the obsolescence of the Brown/Yellow wire to the regulator and starter solenoid, but unless there are any potential risks involved in retaining them I'd prefer to leave them as is. I'm definitely a reluctant 'sparky'......... so any advice on this would be welcomed. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 its fine to just tape them back and leave for the originality brigade to re instate , dont think that will happen but do whatever you are happy with its no problem Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SixasStandard Posted June 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 Latest update on the Alternator project..........I've now got the Alternator fitted in the car and have connected up the required cables in the engine bay. There had been some interesting choices made with routing of the loom, so I took the opportunity to re-route things a bit more tidily, necessitating de-constructing it a bit before then rebinding it. The new Lucas RB340 Regulator box has now been installed with revised connections, so everything is now ready to go once I've received the new longer fan belt that has been ordered. I decided to keep the old Dynamo cables in place for reasons previously explained, and the fact that they are connected to the Alternator makes for a tidier engine bay in my opinion. I've attached some pictures for general interest, and in the case of the engine bay picture.......if you can spot the deliberate error then kudos to you!! Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now