yorkshire_spam Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 I can't find the slot head machine screws for the timing cover or the sealing block on my Spitfire 1500 engine build. Does anyone have a set in reasonable second hand condition they'd be prepared to part with? Or alternatively does anyone know of a supplier that sells the slot head version rather than cross heads? I think they are: PT803 5/16" UNF X 3/8" slotted pan head machine screws (5 for the timing cover) ????? 5/16" X 5/8" UNF slotted pan head machine screws (2 for the sealing block) Cheers, Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppyman Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 Hi Sam, i have had similar from these guy's in the past.https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNF-Machine-Screws-3-16-1-4-5-16-3-8-9-16-No-10/291875342429?hash=item43f520485d:m:mvKPy4Su7Bka28Soq5xmNTA Are they what you are looking for? Tony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 Thanks Tony - looks like that would be the answer, but the appropriate size is out of stock - I'll contact them! Oh beggar, just noticed the eBay listing says "old stock" so chances of then restocking might be low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 1 hour ago, yorkshire_spam said: I think they are: PT803 5/16" UNF X 3/8" slotted pan head machine screws (5 for the timing cover) ????? 5/16" X 5/8" UNF slotted pan head machine screws (2 for the sealing block) They are, Sam, and I've had a recent discussion online with some suppliers who had photos of the originals on their site but supplied Philip's versions for my Herald before telling me that is all I'll get these days. I've been advised to buy metric and retap the metal, which may work for some of the timing cover screws but is not ideal. https://www.fixaball.co.uk/products/m3-machine-screws-slotted-pan-head-a2-stainless-steel?variant=24158657223 I've found similar in UNC: https://www.a2stainless.co.uk/4-40-UNC-x-5-16-Slot-Pan-Head-Screw_ARHYP.aspx ...plus others listed as a 5/16 6-32 thread, which Pete will have to explain. I may have located some on a USA site: https://www.spitbits.com/store/85-PAN-HEAD-SCREW-MK41500-5req-P2601.aspx There are so many bolt and fastener sites on the Net it would take days to check them all. I'm going to tour a few local hardware shops with one in my pocket and see if they have any old stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerguzzi Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 1 hour ago, yorkshire_spam said: I can't find the slot head machine screws for the timing cover or the sealing block on my Spitfire 1500 engine build. Does anyone have a set in reasonable second hand condition they'd be prepared to part with? Or alternatively does anyone know of a supplier that sells the slot head version rather than cross heads? I think they are: PT803 5/16" UNF X 3/8" slotted pan head machine screws (5 for the timing cover) ????? 5/16" X 5/8" UNF slotted pan head machine screws (2 for the sealing block) Cheers, Sam Hello Sam I probably have a set as I did not refit them I used hex heads (they are only there to stop numptys over tightening them as they have short threads. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerguzzi Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 Hello Sam Just had a look in my old nut and bolt drawer and can only find 2 3/8" ones and they are slightly different heads! Sorry Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Colin Lindsay said: They are, Sam, and I've had a recent discussion online with some suppliers who had photos of the originals on their site but supplied Philip's versions for my Herald before telling me that is all I'll get these days. I've been advised to buy metric and retap the metal, which may work for some of the timing cover screws but is not ideal. https://www.fixaball.co.uk/products/m3-machine-screws-slotted-pan-head-a2-stainless-steel?variant=24158657223 I've found similar in UNC: https://www.a2stainless.co.uk/4-40-UNC-x-5-16-Slot-Pan-Head-Screw_ARHYP.aspx ...plus others listed as a 5/16 6-32 thread, which Pete will have to explain. I may have located some on a USA site: https://www.spitbits.com/store/85-PAN-HEAD-SCREW-MK41500-5req-P2601.aspx There are so many bolt and fastener sites on the Net it would take days to check them all. I'm going to tour a few local hardware shops with one in my pocket and see if they have any old stock. Thanks Colin, I've been searching and emailing all the usual suspects... maybe shipping them over from the US-of-A is the only realistic way. 52 minutes ago, rogerguzzi said: Hello Sam Just had a look in my old nut and bolt drawer and can only find 2 3/8" ones and they are slightly different heads! Sorry Roger Thanks for looking Roger! I appreciate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerguzzi Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 Hello Sam How about these people? They list 5/16" x 1 1/4" which you could shorten Roger https://www.arunfasteners.co.uk/stock-range/screws/machine-screws/unf-machine-screws/unf-pan-slotted-machine-screws/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 surely someone must have a wrecked dismantled engine that can supply the bits. I've seen S/S allen headed timing cover bolts advertised on Triumph ebay websites if originality isn't too critical. if your really pushed I could rustle up a set of panheads but i'd have to ship from Aus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2020 12 hours ago, rogerguzzi said: Hello Sam How about these people? They list 5/16" x 1 1/4" which you could shorten Roger https://www.arunfasteners.co.uk/stock-range/screws/machine-screws/unf-machine-screws/unf-pan-slotted-machine-screws/ Good spot Roger! Thanks! 12 hours ago, Peter Truman said: surely someone must have a wrecked dismantled engine that can supply the bits. I've seen S/S allen headed timing cover bolts advertised on Triumph ebay websites if originality isn't too critical. if your really pushed I could rustle up a set of panheads but i'd have to ship from Aus. I think the fundamental problem is my fussy-ness Peter - I have in the garage enough short 5/16" UNF hex head set screws to do the job, I can get button or cap head hex machine screws quite easily. I can even get posi-drive pan head screws... what I was struggling to get are the original spec slotted pan-head type. I'm not an originallity freak or anything, but I just wanted to use the original style ones. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted January 24, 2020 Report Share Posted January 24, 2020 and to add all are 5/16unf timing cover pan heads 4lbft after settlement these only go in the engine plate , its thin any higher torque will strip them any through to the block or have a nut are bolt/setscrews seal block cheese heads 12/14 lbft setscrews all 18/20lbft pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted January 24, 2020 Report Share Posted January 24, 2020 I have Heli-Coiled ALL the tapped holes in the alloy sealing block as daughters current engine were stripped to some degree & leaks too much. I made sure the coil end was below the hole top and after inserting the threads I spent time ensuring the block was flat. I'm just completing the spare engine rebuild so yet to see if it works ie seals tight, as far as screwing in the pan head timing cover and hex sump bolts that's all worked well all positive and tight. I've also done a couple of spare seal blocks for future rebuilds, hey if it doesn't work ie seal I'll just buy the club steel one and do it AGAIN. Peter T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted January 24, 2020 Report Share Posted January 24, 2020 most strip the alloy due to long bolts where a short one is specified ....bottoming out ............ or gorilla hands i have in the past reclaimed by tapping 8mm x1.25 or up to 3/8" x 24 unf both fixes worked for some years pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 just rummaging around and OE 100501 5/16"unf cheese head now sold by many as SW605081 ( eg revingtons ) none in the hardware catelogue but does show PT803 as 5/15unf slot drive cheese head rimmers sw605081 pic posidrive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 13 minutes ago, Pete Lewis said: just rummaging around and OE 100501 5/16"unf cheese head now sold by many as SW605081 ( eg revingtons ) none in the hardware catelogue but does show PT803 as 5/15unf slot drive cheese head rimmers sw605081 pic posidrive Pete, most of the usual suspects (Paddock, Moss, Rimmers, Canley) seem to be quietly listings the posi-head as "equivalent" to the original spec items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 17 minutes ago, yorkshire_spam said: Pete, most of the usual suspects (Paddock, Moss, Rimmers, Canley) seem to be quietly listings the posi-head as "equivalent" to the original spec items. That's what I'm finding. It's an easy option for suppliers; there may not be a huge demand for them but at the end of the day they're only screws so no massive outlay and while I'm no anorak I do like to replace timing covers with the proper items. I think my only option is to blast my originals and then just paint over them, which I'm reluctant to do as the shiny silver ones look a lot neater. IMHO of course! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 using new nuts bolts hose clips etc makes a nice finish to any handywork cant abide using old oily gunged up fixings some seem to revel in keeping old worn out bolts with knarled heads and rusted threads , and stuffed washers as some ritual to originality bright and clean presentation wins for me every time Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 18 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said: That's what I'm finding. It's an easy option for suppliers; there may not be a huge demand for them but at the end of the day they're only screws so no massive outlay and while I'm no anorak I do like to replace timing covers with the proper items. I think my only option is to blast my originals and then just paint over them, which I'm reluctant to do as the shiny silver ones look a lot neater. IMHO of course! If I can find enough original ones I plan to clean them and then zinc or nickle plate them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 4 hours ago, yorkshire_spam said: If I can find enough original ones I plan to clean them and then zinc or nickle plate them. Do you plate them yourself? I'd be interested in the process, or the costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 59 minutes ago, Colin Lindsay said: Do you plate them yourself? I'd be interested in the process, or the costs. I've been contemplating getting a DIY plating kit for a while for small parts like bracketry etc. So I was going to have a go myself with one of those (after trying it first on some less "unobtainium" rusty bolts) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 I bought a DIY plating kit a couple of years back for bits of the Spitfire rebuild. I made a video of the process here 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted January 27, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 Arun fastners have quoted about 60p each for the 1.1/4" ones, so I'm probably going to order those and them shorten them to 3/8" and 5/8" Their minimum order value means I'll have about 20 if anyone else wants any? (Just going to wait a few days for a couple of other compaines to come back to me before ordering) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffipaul Posted January 27, 2020 Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 Be careful attempting to plate fasteners yourself , fraught with danger , hydrogen embrittlement is a problem especially on high tensile stuff and controllng thickness to ensure correct fit. I like using nice shiny new fixings also but not sure how long they will stay shiny though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted January 27, 2020 Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 how accurate are the Arun ones? There's no photograph and I wouldn't want to find the correct dimension and thread on a head that's smaller than the original engine screw. The originals are quite flat, and quite large. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted February 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2020 A very generous and helpful person sent me some old ones to clean up and try plating. I also got some from Arun fastners... Old vs Arun... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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