Tipidave Posted November 10, 2022 Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 Hi All I now have a three rail spitfire gearbox stamped with FH number and a d type overdrive that I want to fit to my 1200 herald. The unit has been stood for many years. The solenoid plunger was sticking and found to be lightly corroded. It is now free and clean and operating with a 1.1amp maintaining current. With the inspection cover off the hole in the brass lever exactly aligns with the driled hole in the casing when energised but when released the lever moves back to the right but not as far as it could do. Is this because there is no oil pressure while testing on the bench? Is there any other adjustment? As a secondary issue, I am happy that all forward gears engaging smoothly with no undue play or noise… but for the life of me I cannot engage reverse. Is there a knack or adjustment? It looks like it should be a lift and movement to left of second gear. Any help as ever greatfully received. 😀👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted November 10, 2022 Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 30 years I've been driving Heralds. And I just had to run out to the garage and check for reverse. Push down and left, then forward by first gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMi Posted November 10, 2022 Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 They don't move forward very far, so I would say that is OK. Reverse is definitely push down move left and forward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 Ah… the schematic in the gear knob ( with overdrive switch) shows it left of second!) doh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted November 10, 2022 Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 1 minute ago, Tipidave said: Ah… the schematic in the gear knob ( with overdrive switch) shows it left of second!) doh Ah, that’ll be cause you have a knob from a single rail box (FH will be 3 rail 4 synchro with reverse as described by Colin and Dan) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 Thanks for the info… with the gearstick removed I can move the third rail and engage reverse in position as described. However with the gear stick on I cannot move the lever far enough to the left. Does this mean I must adjust the lever that acts on the gear selection rails via the shift rod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2022 Also, is this metal ring correct on the middle rail? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 Yes, the ring on the middle rail is correct. It’s not in all top covers though (I think it’s a later addition from the few I’ve taken apart). Not entirely sure what it is for as the earlier top covers function fine without it. You can’t adjust the arm that engages with the shifting forks. It’s got a single position held by a wedge bolt. Your problem sounds more like bad bushes etc in the gear shift setup, or perhaps poor adjustment of the stud that forces you to push the gear-lever down to move it in to reverse position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 on the solenoid you say on testing it held 11amps it should once its pulled the lever allow a switch in the rear end of the solenoid drop the initial pull in curren back down to around 0.5amp and not hold at 11A . this indicates the sol is not traveling fully or the switch is failed a seized armature is quite common but you have freed that off, the lever doesnt move far its returned by a small spring under the cap nut on top insise here is a spring /ball and a needle tube worth checking the hole in the needle tube is clear while you have it on a bench dont reset the wired castle nut stop plug without reading up how this is set . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMi Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 17 minutes ago, Pete Lewis said: on the solenoid you say on testing it held 11amps it should once its pulled the lever allow a switch in the rear end of the solenoid drop the initial pull in curren back down to around 0.5amp and not hold at 11A . he said 1.1 amps not 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 12 hours ago, Josef said: Ah, that’ll be cause you have a knob from a single rail box (FH will be 3 rail 4 synchro with reverse as described by Colin and Dan) He said reverse is marked "left of second". The single rail puts it next to third. The big saloon box has it next to fourth. I don't think any Triumphs had reverse by second, but many other makes also fitted overdrives with similar gear knobs, so there's bound to be one with it there. 11 hours ago, Tipidave said: Thanks for the info… with the gearstick removed I can move the third rail and engage reverse in position as described. However with the gear stick on I cannot move the lever far enough to the left. Does this mean I must adjust the lever that acts on the gear selection rails via the shift rod? There's a stop at the bottom of the gearstick, so you have to push the lever down to clear that before you can move it left. If the bolt that operates the block has been fitted wrongly, or even if the bolt attaching the gearstick to the shaft is in backwards, then it can prevent proper operation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 11, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 Thanks for the suggestions… something not quite right! Unfortunately I have to work! Would rather be at home fettling 😀👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMi Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 The gear selector probably needs rebushing if you are having difficulty selecting a gear, very common issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 2 hours ago, DanMi said: he said 1.1 amps not 11 Yes got that it was a bit early before any coffee Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 Also note if you put a 3-synchro top cover on a 4-synchro box you lose reverse engagement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 11, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 1 hour ago, thescrapman said: Also note if you put a 3-synchro top cover on a 4-synchro box you lose reverse engagement. Is there any easy way to identify? that spoils my next plan which was to make use of my existing 1200 gearbox top cover. Maybe this is what has been done there … the current gear stick definitely isn’t right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 17 hours ago, Josef said: Yes, the ring on the middle rail is correct. It’s not in all top covers though (I think it’s a later addition from the few I’ve taken apart). Not entirely sure what it is for as the earlier top covers function fine without it I'm stirring the grey matter here but I think that washer is for the 4 syncro box's, not there for 3 syncro 3 rail box's. I'll check my notes on my single rail to 3 rail gearbox with J type OD conversion. See below Canley parts Pic of Spit IV (4 Syncro) showing sleeve UKC0706 on first gear selector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted November 11, 2022 Report Share Posted November 11, 2022 4 hours ago, thescrapman said: Also note if you put a 3-synchro top cover on a 4-synchro box you lose reverse engagement. How / why does this happen? I’ve rebuilt both (gearboxes and top covers) recently and as far as I could see they would be interchangeable except for the reverse light switch fitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted November 12, 2022 Report Share Posted November 12, 2022 a sleeve added is generally to prevent overstrking a fork/sliding sleeve Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 12, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2022 Also, is this metal ring correct on the middle rail? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipidave Posted November 12, 2022 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2022 Would someone care to check my thinking… diagnosis… the gear stick provided with the box is not correct. It has a spring mechanism to lift to reverse rather than press. And should not be part of this set up. prescription… I am thinking that I should be able to take the gear lever (only) from my original herald three synchro box gearbox and substitute it for the wrong ‘un. Is my diagnosis right? will prescription work? I am not interested in having the overdrive switch on the gear lever and plan to use a column mount switch. ince again thanks for help so far 😀👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted November 12, 2022 Report Share Posted November 12, 2022 It may be that the existing overdrive gearstick has just been put together incorrectly? But regardless, yes you will be able to use your existing Herald gearstick as you suggest. The bonus there being that you can probably sell on the gearstick with provision for a switch as they’re not all that easy to come by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted November 12, 2022 Report Share Posted November 12, 2022 25 minutes ago, Tipidave said: diagnosis… the gear stick provided with the box is not correct. It has a spring mechanism to lift to reverse rather than press. And should not be part of this set up That assertion is incorrect. The spring acts between the circlip on the gearstick and the grey ball that sits in the cup in the remote. It resists you pushing the stick down, and is correct for a 3-rail. TBH, there's no way you'd be able to fit a single-rail stick to a 3-rail box without some serious hackery. However, as Josef just beat me to saying, your existing gearstick should work fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted November 12, 2022 Report Share Posted November 12, 2022 Here's our 3 Rail Gear lever fitted to my daughters Mk2 Spit with the later single rail internals fitted into a 3 Rail case with J type overdrive. The daughter wants the std Triumph O/D switch in the lever so my mods at the top currently I've drilled 3in down the center of the shaft, dead center? I want to go another 1.5inchs so a longer drill reqd, Please Tip Dave can you advise what length the hole is for the wires down the gear stick? PT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted November 13, 2022 Report Share Posted November 13, 2022 I didnt think it was as long as that! Only has to come out far enough down to be hidden by the bag type (not rubber) gear lever gaiter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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