6 cylinder spin on oil filter adapter, seals/s replacement

[daverclasper]

Hi. Car has developed an oil leak. Looks like it may be from the outer/main seal and this is visible and crumbly.

Looking at pictures online, this looks like it may be a large, thinnish o ring?. There also appers to be a smaller flat seal, that I assume is internal? (maybe worth replacing this at the same time?).

Any clues on who may supply these, as a bit short on time to research and car is a daily driver.

Cheers

[Pete Lewis]

Triumph GT6 Spin-On Oil Filter Conversion | Rimmer Bros

rimmer bros do a service kit for the adaptor  last item in the list 

never gorilla  the centre bolt  seen crankcases fracture due to heavy hands 

Pete

[daverclasper]

Cheers Pete. I did look at rimmers as they seem good for bits and bobs, though on my phone wasen't getting anywhere.

I guess the different smaller seals and 2 types of securing bolt are for different versions?.  Will order it and when it arrives, take mine off to see what's, what

Thanks

[Steve P]

I have always used this company for anything to do with filters,coolers etc. I believe they supply some retailers.

https://www.thinkauto.com/

Steve

[Waynebaby]

The club shop sells the service kit for the spin-off filter conversion. This includes all the seals and a new bolt

Part number FC290SKIT. £10 + postage.

Wayne

[daverclasper]

Thanks folks.

Well I took the adapter unit off and I it didn't appear to have the inner rubber seal (it appears to be a flat washer type, or an o ring,  depending on who supplies the kits, will either be ok do you know?, as my local Moss has the the o ring types, which includes the large thinner outer seal, where my old one is squarer profile. Also I assume when fitting, the washer type would stay in place better in the corresponding shallow groove in the adapter body)

Anywhere the missing seal might be hiding?, I can't see where myself?.

Also could this missing seal have harmed maybe?, not there's much I can do about it anyway!

Thanks Dave 

 

 

 

[johny]

Can you post pics Dave? If the inner seal leaks, oil is bypassing the filter so not being cleaned before going into bearings etc 

[daverclasper]

Thanks Johny. Never managed to put photos on the forum. No one knew why, when I asked for advice, though it appeared everyone is using I phones, whereas mines Android?.

Mine appears to be the one in the second photo below the main one, that Pete put above, from Rimmers and I assume the inner seal area is the shallow,recessed flat groove, that measures about 5mm across on mine.

That would maybe correspond to the washer type in some of the kits, including the Rimmers one (bottom photo), Also that appears as supplied in the second photo (though different in the first main one?)

My bolt is also the one with the cut out section, down the shank (whatever that does?). Click on pt no to enlarge photos.

Hope this helps.

[Pete Lewis]

i belive there are more than one manufacturer of the spin on base unit  mocal and others  so kits may 

cover a range of designs 

but would agree a flat groove would take a flat section seal not a basic 0 ring 

Pete

[johny]

The two adaptors from Rimmers are the same but one has connections for pipes to an oil cooler. They are both the later design where the centre seal plate is spring loaded and only uses the wide flat seal as it will automatically adjust to the correct position.

Mine is the original solid type and has a narrower channel for the centre seal for which I have to chose one of the different thickness seals that come in the kit. I believe the idea is first you try the thicker inner seal and if this stops the outer seal from being clamped sufficiently when the adaptor is done up you then go to the thinner inner seal... 

No idea what those different bolts are for🤔 

[JohnD]

Dave,

The original seal is a square section "O" ring.   No idea if a round section one would work.   I had a similar problem a while ago, a fairly young seal began to leak, I replaced it, no more leaks!

I presume you have checked that only one ring in the slot?     An old one is difficult to see in the depths of the slot and two leak!    A small electrical screwdriver will tell you if you tap it on the bottom of the slot.    If an old one is there, then cut it with the screwdriver as a chisel, and use the same tool to lever it out.

John

 

[Peter Truman]

My elder cousin fell for that one putting a new seal on top of the old one on his near new Mini Cooper didn’t get around the block before it had pumped all the oil out if I remember he sold the car shortly after and brought a Midget

[Pete Lewis]

we fell into the double seal conundrum when first serviced the Vit6  when bought in 2003

it is not easy to see there is a  old  0 ring down the stepped groove   yes pumps it out very quickly 

 

im sure there are a good few Tee shirts for that Oops !

Pete

 

 

[daverclasper]

Thanks. Mine, on closer inspection, is not the spring loaded central seal face, though though the groove width looks same ish as the Rimmers  ones.

Doesn't seem straight forward. I guess, as long as an o ring was compressing and withstanding oil pressure, it could be Ok?. Maybe fix in place for fitting with a couple of tiny Dab of super glue?.

Also any idea what the smaller copper washer is for on some kits?, can't see it on mine.

Wagger gave a part no club for the club shop kit, when in shop section and tried a search, it says access denied?. Plowed through the listings and second to last was the adapter, though couldn't see repair kit?

Ta

 

 

[Loudkraken470]

The copper washer in the pack goes on the long bolt that connects the filter adapter to the engine block. make sure to change this if you re use the old one it'll most likely leak.

10 minutes ago, daverclasper said:

Also any idea what the smaller copper washer is for on some kits?, can't see it on mine.

 

 

[Waynebaby]

Wagger gave a part no club for the club shop kit, when in shop section and tried a search, it says access denied?. Plowed through the listings and second to last was the adapter, though couldn't see repair kit?

Hi. I got the part number (and the kit) by looking in the hard copy of the club shop catalogue and using the phone.  (I've never managed to find/order anything I want using the on-line system!) 

I've also got the tee-shirt for trying to fit two square section O-rings in the groove in the block.

Wayne (not Wagger)

 

[daverclasper]

Thanks Wayne.

After even further investigation, mine is the spring loaded face plate one after all (it had been forced in off centre, so wasn't moving).

It's made by Mocal, who still appear to be doing them, so getting somewhere hopefully.

Thanks for your input folks

 

[daverclasper]

Picked up repair kit today from Moss. It's for the Mocal one that they sell and that appears the same as mine.

Not sure where to position/how far down, the threaded wing plate thingy on the main bolt goes. It secures the sealing plate and I assume buts up to block. I assume, as it's under tension and won't move as the bolt screws into it?

Thanks 

[Waynebaby]

If I remember correctly the fixing bolt has a waisted unthreaded portion part way along it's length. I screwed the wing plate thingy onto the bolt until it rested in the unthreaded part. This allows the sealing plate to "float" and helps prevent internal leakage caused by dodgy manufacturing tolerances in the machining of the recess in the block.

Wayne

[JohnD]

Copper washer reusable if you anneal it - heat until the flame goes green, then allow to cool.     To restore working softness, copper should be quenched, but a washer will cool in air quickly enough to not need dipping in  water or oil!

John

[Stratton Jimmer]

16 hours ago, JohnD said:

Copper washer reusable if you anneal it - heat until the flame goes green, then allow to cool.

John is absolutely right but beware of overheating the copper. If you take it above 900 F (480 C) it can become brittle and be prone to fracturing. ( I did listen to my lecturer in metallurgy whilst at college in the 70s.)

[daverclasper]

Thanks. Well, the flat inner seal in the kit is not secure at all when fitted (the shallow groove is very shallow, looks about 1mm deep!). Would it be ok to secure with a few tiny dabs of super glue, as I assume when squeezed to the block it won't move anyway?

Ta

 

[johny]

It wont stay in place with a film of oil Dave? I take it that as its spring loaded the seal is the first thing to make contact with the block as you put the adaptor in place? Then it shouldnt move as you tighten up the bolt plus the lube on the seals will allow you to rotate the adaptor if necessary to get the filter in the most upright position possible....

[daverclasper]

Thanks Johny. I can try that, just a bit concerned, that if does move, I won't be able to see that

[Firefly]

 

           Grease is your friend.  Wipe any oil off the seal and the adapter, then a good smear of grease on either surface will hold the seal in position till it's assembled.

       Mac