Electric car heater

[dougbgt6]

13 minutes ago, JohnD said:

A Haynes for working on EVs?   I don't think so!  Not soon anyway.

Oh ye of little faith, Haynes can do anything!

db

[mpbarrett]

3 hours ago, JohnD said:

A Haynes for working on EVs?   I don't think so!  Not soon anyway.   Afrined runs an indie garage and has "been on a course".    The H&S provisos are extraordinary, for instance anyone working on the electric side will do ONE-HANDED!     So they can't get 400V across both arms.

John

shouldn't be any worse than working on HV systems. But then the guys doing that are electricians and are taught the risks and how to mitigate them.
For EV cars the guys tend to be mechanics  who are converting to becoming electricians so I can see the increased risk. HV DC is very nasty...

The local VW main dealer (very large dealership) has one technician who is able to look at Hybrid, EV cars. When our 'gold plated, filled with unicorn hair' charging cable (£1000) failed it was going to be over 2 weeks before he had time to look at it (and £60 to plug it in and show that it did not work)…. 
New one purchased from Ebay for £150 and the old one stripped to understand how it worked {basically a couple of relays to completely isolate the car, L, N and earth, a built in RCD cct and a bit of signal electronics to tell the car what charging current to draw}.

mike

[Colin Lindsay]

4 hours ago, JohnD said:

For instance anyone working on the electric side will do ONE-HANDED!     So they can't get 400V across both arms.

John

That should suit me at present then. I should imagine holding something in the mouth, like a torch, to free the hands up is also not on...

 

[JohnD]

That's my point - HV DC requires a higher level of training than yer average domestic car wrangler has.     Haynes will not feel it safe to publish advice that Johnny Headinair might use to.get killed, or worse burn themselves horribly.

[Colin Lindsay]

Met a car yesterday going the wrong way on a dual carriageway. He was turning so as to go bonnet-to-bonnet with jump leads for another car a couple of hundred yards away that had conked out. Not sure whether to blame that one on the petrol engine, or the electrics... but the idiots are definitely out there already 

[dougbgt6]

1 hour ago, JohnD said:

That's my point - HV DC requires a higher level of training than yer average domestic car wrangler has

No, not higher just different, it's not rocket science. We all go on training courses, well, used to. 

1 hour ago, JohnD said:

Haynes will not feel it safe to publish advice that Johnny Headinair might use to.get killed, or worse burn themselves horribly.

But Haynes already publish books on motor cars, dangerous things by all accounts.

Doug

[Ian Faulds]

On 18/01/2020 at 14:39, Colin Lindsay said:

I know it's a genuinely serious thing, and we're going to need to do something asap, but I just think we're the ones footing all the bills and having all the restrictions and guilt placed on us while China, India, Brazil, and the like continue to belch out pollution and do absolutely nothing about it. Next thing, we'll be paying vast sums of money to those countries to cut down emissions; money we could use on our own infrastructure and welfare.

Add Philippino volcanoes and Australian bush fires and my little car exhaust or my wood-burning stove seems to be small fry indeed.

exactly my views colin, add to this Russia and the u.s.a lack of interest. I notice the Australian bush fire smoke went to new Zealand and indeed circled the globe, so we could be the cleanest country in the world but if the wind blows the wrong way ???

I know we ALL have to improve but I think the average man in the street doesn't want to lose his central heating boiler or economical diesel car just because of the climate bullies.

 

 

[NonMember]

There was an article on, I think, "More or Less" which included an interesting observation. On the face of things, Europe is very active on climate change and clamping down on emissions, while America is in denial and just keeps polluting. Dig a bit deeper, though, and you find that the economic consequence of Europe's climate laws is that a lot of "dirty manufacturing" is not really being closed down, but rather moved off-shore to China. The Chinese plants are generally even dirtier than the European ones, and there is the added carbon cost of shipping, too. Meanwhile, for reasons completely unconnected with climate, the US administration has been putting a lot of effort into "reshoring" - moving production back to the US, where the shipping is vastly reduced.

So on the one hand, I'm very much on Greta Thunberg's side of the global argument, because our children's children will otherwise inherit a poisonous wasteland incapable of sustaining human life. On the other hand, we need to act in the light of a very, very broad picture that involves all nations making unpopular decisions that won't even satisfy many of the climate activists in the short term. Is that even possible in a world with so many bad political systems at play?

[Colin Lindsay]

6 hours ago, NonMember said:

On the face of things, Europe is very active on climate change and clamping down on emissions, while America is in denial and just keeps polluting. Dig a bit deeper, though, and you find that the economic consequence of Europe's climate laws is that a lot of "dirty manufacturing" is not really being closed down, but rather moved off-shore to China. The Chinese plants are generally even dirtier than the European ones

Yep; it's rather like the concept of electricity. It's generated elsewhere, so we can all pretend that it's non-polluting, since we can't see it in our locality. Nimby-ism in it's purest form. 

[AndyTV8]

When I discuss this subject with friends, the topic Is really split into two key areas .....  1) if you choose an EV from a financial point of view (company car tax, your journeys suited to save fuel coast by running mostly on the batteries) then fill your boots but   2) don’t try and convince people that the manufacturing costs, mining conditions for workers, battery recycling and origin of that electricity are ticking all of the green boxes (currently)

....... Andy 

 

[Anglefire]

Many diesel cars have a supplementary heater to get the engine warm quicker when its cold and to keep it warm - my Discovery had one - which I added a controller so I could start it before going out and resulted in a warmer car when you get in. My neighbours Range Rover is started on a timer I think in the morning, but its the engine not just the webasto heater. Not sure how that works being an unattended vehicle, but must be legal.

Many truck have them too so they can keep warm when they are parked up.

As for EV's that is another ball game and is the next one to cause a riot due to the conditions the miners (Often Minors) work in.

[Colin Lindsay]

My Diesel Mondeo takes about six to eight miles before the temperature gauge starts to move, and that's only a 1.6. Not only that but it cools at the drop of a hat; park up to go into a shop and when you come out, it's cold again. I doubt if it will ever reach normal operating temperature when idling.

Is there a Motability scheme on mainland UK? Over here they're now pushing for all Motability cars to be electric. It's a real moneyspinner for Car Dealerships over here, and this should be another great boost for profits given the higher costs of EV.

[NonMember]

In the current weather my petrol Mondeo takes six miles for the temperature gauge to move. I'm beginning to wonder whether the thermostat's stuck open, TBH.

[Pete Lewis]

many of my diesels be they renault or citroen had a built in  12v  electric heater to supplement cold warm up you could hear the relays click in and out  when on cold starts 

others must be similar  

Pete