HELP!

[Dave the tram]

Help, I’m in a bit of a pickle here. Does anyone have experience of a reliable bodyshop/ restorer in the north or midlands - or perhaps anywhere in the country! After looking around for a good bodyshop for welding some minor panel repair sections and a respray for my GT6, I thought I was sorted. Found somewhere 15 miles away that does this sort of thing and has some experience of classics - quite liked the outfit. Gave the car a full look over on two occasions with them, agreed a plan and agreed a date way in advance - to start beginning of October. This slipped, which is fine if previous job overran a bit, but kept slipping (2 months and counting) and now can’t seem to make contact. Not replying to messages nor picking up my calls so I’ll end up paying a visit as a last resort. So disappointing and frustrating. Part of the deal was that I stripped off all components and then built it back up afterwards (to keep the cost in budget) so spent a month doing this ahead of the planned date. I now have an un-drivable stripped down car sat there, which I would normally use almost daily, plus lots of restored or new bits waiting to put back, so my main hobby is also on hold. Can barely face the idea of bodging the car up with filler and spray cans then putting it all back together. This would be soul destroying and two months work wasted. Likewise I can’t really master both welding and spraying myself just for this one job, so I will probably need to find someone else. Tricky now that I can’t take the car to them, but if need be I’ll bite the bullet and get it transported if I can find somewhere. The car is basically sound but needs outer wheel arch bottoms, bonnet hinge turrets repairing, some small areas of rust that were previously filled, and then a respray. I have what I think is a reasonable budget of £3k, £4K max.
Any help or suggestions very gratefully received. 

Dave

 

 

[PeteH]

35 minutes ago, Dave the tram said:

Help, I’m in a bit of a pickle here. Does anyone have experience of a reliable bodyshop/ restorer in the north or midlands - or perhaps anywhere in the country! After looking around for a good bodyshop for welding some minor panel repair sections and a respray for my GT6, I thought I was sorted. Found somewhere 15 miles away that does this sort of thing and has some experience of classics - quite liked the outfit. Gave the car a full look over on two occasions with them, agreed a plan and agreed a date way in advance - to start beginning of October. This slipped, which is fine if previous job overran a bit, but kept slipping (2 months and counting) and now can’t seem to make contact. Not replying to messages nor picking up my calls so I’ll end up paying a visit as a last resort. So disappointing and frustrating. Part of the deal was that I stripped off all components and then built it back up afterwards (to keep the cost in budget) so spent a month doing this ahead of the planned date. I now have an un-drivable stripped down car sat there, which I would normally use almost daily, plus lots of restored or new bits waiting to put back, so my main hobby is also on hold. Can barely face the idea of bodging the car up with filler and spray cans then putting it all back together. This would be soul destroying and two months work wasted. Likewise I can’t really master both welding and spraying myself just for this one job, so I will probably need to find someone else. Tricky now that I can’t take the car to them, but if need be I’ll bite the bullet and get it transported if I can find somewhere. The car is basically sound but needs outer wheel arch bottoms, bonnet hinge turrets repairing, some small areas of rust that were previously filled, and then a respray. I have what I think is a reasonable budget of £3k, £4K max.
Any help or suggestions very gratefully received. 

Dave

 

Ouch!!. I feel your pain. I`ve done all the welding and most of the fettleing on My 13/60. But need a sprayshop?. Can I find one? snowballs chance in hell. They appear to all be socked in with Repair work and no one wants to spend time on any "classics". The one shop that did, has a wait list to 2024/5. I`m currently looking to DIY. If I can get a large enough "party tent" to use as a popup spray booth, and in order to keep the pigeon poop off the paint!! with the intention to errect it in a friend`s son`s Barn.

Pete

[Josef]

Willow Triumph in Darlington (perhaps more north than you were wanting!). Tim there is now probably the only person I’d trust to work on my car(s). But you will almost certainly not get in quickly. £4k might be tight as over half that will go on paintwork. 

[Dave the tram]

Hi Pete

Hmmm.! Interesting. Looks like we customers might not be in a very strong position. If this seems to be the common experience, it might point towards trying to salvage things with this guy if he can restore some confidence with me and assuming some tragedy hasn’t befallen him. The total radio silence is a bit perplexing. I’d better learn some real patience it seems.

Cheers

Dave

[Dave the tram]

Thanks Joseph. Depending on how things pan out, having a chat to your man in Darlington might not be out of the question if we could find a way to keep to £4K. Will keep this in mind. If I ended up giving him a call I could give him a video tour around and under the car as a starting point to see if it was something he might take on. Like a said, it’s fairly sound but even with the car stripped of components, the  rubbing down would be a big part of the cost unless I decided to tackle much of that myself.

Cheers

Dave

[Neil Clark]

Dave, a really good retired professional bodyshop guy and sprayer I follow in the MG Owners Club just did his sons MGB GT as below, full body re-spray, and although it was for himself he kept a timesheet for us to follow.  It was 68 hours plus £600 materials for a really good result including prep and doing it in his (huge) home workshop.  At say £50 / hour that's a total of £4,000 plus VAT.  My Spitfire, which also needed welding on the new bonnet hinges and fitting the bonnet, removing the windscreen etc etc, cost £3,500 plus VAT last May for a really thorough finish on the bonnet alone and quick re-spray of the tub (which was pretty good before but I wanted a great colour match.  (The B GT in the background is their exhibition project car which was on the stand at the NEC)

I had mine done at TJR Bodyworx in Kings Norton near Birmingham.  Gaz the owner is great.  But he's very busy and it was there months.

[Clive]

2 hours ago, PeteH said:

Ouch!!. I feel your pain. I`ve done all the welding and most of the fettleing on My 13/60. But need a sprayshop?. Can I find one? snowballs chance in hell. They appear to all be socked in with Repair work and no one wants to spend time on any "classics". The one shop that did, has a wait list to 2024/5. I`m currently looking to DIY. If I can get a large enough "party tent" to use as a popup spray booth, and in order to keep the pigeon poop off the paint!! with the intention to errect it in a friend`s son`s Barn.

Pete

Look up "inflatable spray booth"

I know somebody who bought one, used it and then sold it on. He lost £100, which was a bargain for him. Good filtration etc all included. 

I have sprayed in my garage, but last car (few months ago) I did under the car port. Much less crap in the paint. I used 2K, and an old (don't laugh) ex military gasmask fed from a diaphragm compressor. That provides safe air. 2K paint is fantastic, even if only for the primer as it doesn't sink like celly. 

As to costs, easy to spend £500 on the materials for a basic respray. I bought 5L of 2k paint for £120, but hardener was another £25. That was before primer, abrasives etc. And a 3L tub of filler for blending repairs, plus a tube of acrylic stopper. 

[PeteH]

8 hours ago, clive said:

"inflatable spray booth"

Had a look at those, they look the business, biggest drawback is the need to run the fan permanently to keep the shape. With the current cost of electricity that could be expensive?. Hence the search for a possible second hand party tent on a rigid frame. the strength is not critical as it`s going into a Barn anyway. So cheap and dump if neccessary after use?.

Now got a line on an Old time, Painter Near Brid; in Yorkshire. He did some work for a friend. Just catching him when he is there as he only seems to work part time now. I have even considered doing the Prime by brush, while I get sorted with how I do the final coat. I spoke to a guy who reckons Acrylic is the way to go? He coach paints for the "steam" fraternity.

Pete.

 

[Clive]

5 minutes ago, PeteH said:

Had a look at those, they look the business, biggest drawback is the need to run the fan permanently to keep the shape. With the current cost of electricity that could be expensive?. Hence the search for a possible second hand party tent on a rigid frame. the strength is not critical as it`s going into a Barn anyway. So cheap and dump if neccessary after use?.

Now got a line on an Old time, Painter Near Brid; in Yorkshire. He did some work for a friend. Just catching him when he is there as he only seems to work part time now. I have even considered doing the Prime by brush, while I get sorted with how I do the final coat. I spoke to a guy who reckons Acrylic is the way to go? He coach paints for the "steam" fraternity.

Pete.

 

Depends which "acrylic" he means.

2K is often referred to as Acrylic, and is great (ignoring the potential health risks of applying the stuff, sorted with an air fed mask etc)

If he means a synthetic type paint, don't do it. Looks OK from the gun, but never goes really hard and can't be polished. Fine on lorries/agricultural stuff, not so good on cars.

 

[Gary Flinn]

I have no personal experience of these people but they are based near Long Eaton and seem to get good reviews? 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwi2mu6V4sH7AhWGh1wKHfF5ApMQFnoECA8QAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blyandson.co.uk%2F&usg=AOvVaw3Ip1Tww9Wdiv0LJ1NZc-ZC

I had a quote off them for some work and they where within 5% of another quote I got for some remedials on my current Classic?

Hope you get it sorted

Gary

[Keith Nock]

When rebuilding my GT6. I used wellingore garage just south of Lincoln . Very happy with results not sure on cost now as my car was painted 14 years ago but not a spot of rust after all that time

.Regards keith

[foshi]

i do building  maintenance for a car body repair shop in surrey , they have just completed work on a mga came bare metal they carried out some body repairs total respray great job better than new. i asked what it had cost the owner told will have no change from 10k 

[Paulfc]

Dave,

I appreciate your dilemma having been let down twice by people who on the face of things were genuine guys but in fact were simply unreliable and, sadly, unprincipled.

I’m a member of a local car club and a number of members have had body and paintwork done over many years by the business below and have been impressed to the point were  they now advertise regularly in the club magazine.

I appreciate, too, it’s a 50mile- ish haul from where you are but it might be worth giving them a call/visit. 

Paul

[Dave the tram]

Thanks all for the fantastic response with several leads to follow if need be. I plan to drive down tomorrow to call in on the garage I’d planned to use and draw a line under it one way or another. Perhaps some mishap has befallen them, who knows. For now I may end up simply trying to find someone who can do a good job welding the repair sections to the wheel arch bottoms and do a plated repair on the bottoms of the front chassis bits (hinge turrets and one bracing cross member - you can’t see those bits!). I might fully strip the rear of the outer sills and base of the B pillars just to confirm my belief that everything is solid ahead of the outer arches. Then use filler and rattle cans for now, as I’ve been happily doing for the past 15 years. It was smart enough for me, I just had the ambition to make it more sound and rust free ready for the next 15 years! Worth giving a call to the various folk mentioned though before I give up on the full project plan.

Cheers

Dave

[Dave the tram]

Made the 40 mile round trip to the bodyshop today - the forum feedback was useful as it pointed me towards trying to salvage the position, rather than be complaining, after realising that I might struggle to find anyone else to do it within the next year and within my budget. They were a little embarrassed and fairly humble. They have, as several of you hinted, been very busy with accident insurance work and didn’t want to have a longer project taking up space. I now have fairly firm date in early January for the car to be collected so will update the forum in the new year on progress and final outcome. Fingers crossed for being back on the road early spring and will keep the list of possible alternative options up my sleeve.

Dave

[Neil Clark]

Dave, at both of the bodyshops I've used in the last three years, asking them to collect was my mistake.  Other customers kept jumping in ahead by turning up with their cars and leaving them there "Go on, I'm desperate for it for work" was the usual excuse.  So I hired a trailer and took it over there so that in theory it was mine in the way of others.  Even then I kept getting bumped a bit more each week but they said it was always in the corner of their eye...........

[johny]

Sounds like it needs a sliding scale pricing arrangement where the shop gets the full quoted price if finished in the agreed month and then a percentage less each month of delay thereafter😊

[PeteH]

I suspect the bottom line so to speak is the volume of Damage repair work out there. Most body shops of any quality are looking at long lead times for anything. Just a small example is my Motorhome booked in for the Starter Motor to be replaced on a 3 week lead in. If it was light enough I would have done it myself but without getting it ramped, the S-M is not that accessible, and my jacks wont cope with a near 2 tonne front end.

Pete

[Colin Lindsay]

12 hours ago, PeteH said:

I suspect the bottom line so to speak is the volume of Damage repair work out there. Most body shops of any quality are looking at long lead times for anything. 

Accident repair work is the big moneyspinner. They're claiming off Insurance Companies so will claim for absolutely everything possible, from consumables to labour, and of course charge much more than they can expect from the man in the street. I have some local guys that will do classic work, but it needs quite a long booking - four months was the last wait for my Herald, and even then they'll work around anything that comes in which requires a speedy return.

[Clive]

A retired friend does a few hours a week at a bodyshop (supposidly just doing "old stuff") 

It seems they book classics in to fill any spare time, but they just don't have any spare time. So progress can be very slow. And customers don't seem to worry. 

But from a business perspective, having a car take up space for a year (or more) seems madness, better to employ another bod full time and turn more work over. I expect customers would be happier too. 

[Gully]

I had a quotation 2 years ago to bare metal respray my GT6, along with a repair to the off-side rear quarter - around £9k + VAT. I had 50% of the work done to align with my budget at the time, spending around £5.5-6k (including the repair). When I went back for a confirmed quotation for the balance of work a couple of months ago, I was quoted £9-10k + VAT... Needless to say, it's not being done!

Picking up the suggestion above of a sliding scale of charging, the work I had done originally took double the quoted time (it was fitted around insurance and race repair work), so the body shop reduced their hourly rate on the final invoice.

Gully

[Neil Clark]

Around here in SW London the big complaint from engineering businesses and I imagine the bodyshops too is that firstly the East Europeans have left and that secondly local rents have driven people out of London.  So they have to compete for decent people and throughput suffers while wage rates go up.  Takes me back to A Levels - "price elasticity of demand"

[Steve P]

My local classic friendly garage, where the owner and his work partner are both at retiring age, cannot get any decent labour to help, he just sacked a chap he had working for a few years who suddenly developed a habit of forgetting to put things back together properly. He told me he did 2 Fiat clutches and forgot to bolt the gearbox back in properly, both fell out, one was trash and the other recoverable. Cost him a lot of time and money to put right.

I have a cousin locally who painted both my cars and does great work, he`s a Mini man mainly.Sadly a bit far from the original poster.

S

[Dave the tram]

Some good luck at last! I followed up Josef’s suggestion (many thanks) and contacted Tim at Willow Triumph in Darlington. Had a good chat and as expected he was booked up until summer 2025! But when I said I might try and just get the bodywork and welding done for now - he said ‘send me some picks, I’ve just done a GT6 with very similar issues.’ To my delight got a one line email next day - ‘ I’ll do it, if you can get the car to me now along with the required repair sections as I have a small window of opportunity’.

Get it back Monday with all the require repair sections welded in to rear arches etc and chassis front end rebuilt. Well worth the cost of transport to get it all done properly by someone who knows triumphs inside out. 

I’ll now start a new thread for this with a more meaningful title.

Dave