Colourtune?

[Roger89]

Going to treat myself (and her)as she's running so so bad.  but what size do I need for a spitfire 1500? I was guessing a 14mm Thanks in advance

[johny]

hmmm Ive got one but havent used it for years as I found the results gave too much variation. I adjust my Vitesse using the little plungers on the Stromberg carbs....

[daverclasper]

Same as Johny (then look at plug colour as well). I think SU's use the the lifting pins as well?.

[Adrian]

I got one for the triumph and TBH waste of money (could be user error) but basically made the mixture way too lean. Could be because I needed 2 for simultaneous tuning of both carbs. I reset the jet/needle with the method Pete showed us and left it at that.

[RogerH]

11 hours ago, Roger89 said:

Going to treat myself (and her)as she's running so so bad.  but what size do I need for a spitfire 1500? I was guessing a 14mm Thanks in advance

I read, recently, that they are of limited value as the engine really needs to be under strain to get a correct simulation for getting the main running sorted (a rolling road etc)

The lifting pin and colour of the plugs is very workable.

 

Roger

[Paul H]

Same for me . Never even used it on my Vitesse . Still in the box , will be going on EBay when I get round to it .

I use plug colour to tune 

Paul 

[poppyman]

This would give much better results, a bit expensive (but so is fuel) They do come up second hand sometimes.https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gunson-Digital-Exhaust-Gas-Tester-Analyzer-Race-Rally-Car-G4125/362455923901?epid=17034595731&hash=item54640e7cbd:g:JyYAAOSwLw5dlzpa

Tony.

[Paul H]

30 minutes ago, poppyman said:

This would give much better results, a bit expensive (but so is fuel) They do come up second hand sometimes.https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gunson-Digital-Exhaust-Gas-Tester-Analyzer-Race-Rally-Car-G4125/362455923901?epid=17034595731&hash=item54640e7cbd:g:JyYAAOSwLw5dlzpa

Tony.

Hi Tony , how would you use the tester to set the correct mixture / timing 

Paul 

[Pete Lewis]

ive got two colour tune and a gunsons analyser  all in the back of the cupboard  never get used, rarely us a balancer 

ears work just as well and are cheap  and if youre lucky you ve got two already !!!

balance . set the throttle idle screws from shut just touching and turn in 1.5 turns  lock the link rods  so the throttles are all mechanically set the same 

set needles flush with base of piston 

wind jet to flush with bridge and back it down 3 turns ( 2 may be ok )  this is a good start point  

turn everything the same amount on each for small changes to mixture or idle speeds

this is how they were set for production fitment , no gas flowed or balances   just simple mechanical being 'the same '

this applies to SU or Strombergs 

later economy devices and tamper proofing of the 70s  strombergs >>

top adjustable stroms  level the small needle delrin washer flush with the piston base 

make sure temperature compensators are sealed with two 0 rings and the sods are adjusted to be closed 

jump in and drive it 

Pete

 

[Pete Lewis]

the gunson analysers gives readings of Hc and Co   needs a long time to get to a stable temperature and is quite slow at showing changes 

very plastic and diy  quality ,  tend to be a right faf to get realistic results ,   but they do work 

we had some  semi portable  Horiba  infra red analysers in my emmision test dept  , kept one but could not get a supply of calibration gas from BOxygen 

in the end they went up the tip.    nice expensive but not for the home 

Pete

[poppyman]

It depends how good your ears are Pete? I agree with you about taking ages to settle, but they are good for the diy man.

Paul, if you get one of these? start as Pete say's and you will be somewhere right, then use the tester. They are a bit of a faf taking time to settle. Another way is if you know your mot tester? Bung him a few quid to set them up with his professional test equipment  

Tony.

[Roger89]

Yes thanks Pete and everyone. Bought the car as a project case. Had to concentrate on rear as diff exploded on way home. Only now got round to the engine. It was running so rough when I took it out to test new diff and all the work on the rear end we did. Would only run with choke full on even after it warmed up. Set about changing all the electronics, new plugs, points, condenser, HT leads, cap, coil, rotor arm etc. Was waiting for the colour tune to arrive before I started on carbs. Think I'm going to strip them down off the car and give them a thorough clean. I've got a new exhaust manifold to fit anyway. So much to check its mind blowing where to start. Not even sure if the petrol in the tank is any good as it was in storage before I bought it and it's a full tank even though the gauge is only showing 1/4

So many other  things could be wrong timing, valves, piston rings etc. Just have to plough on 1 by 1. Wish me luck, thanks again Pete I'll set the carbs just like that when I rebuild them. Can you recommend a needle kit for me?

Cheers

Roger

Ps Hoping to get it running  (of sorts) in time for the TSSC Christmas open day at HQ

[RogerH]

Hi Roger,

old modern petrol can go iffy but near with it and top up with the odd gallon pr so as it goes down.

In future if you suspect an issue with the electrics try to change one item at a time.

Otherwise you will not know what the problem is/was and will end up throwing some good parts away.

If the  fuel is suspect have a tin of 'Start you Bast&^d'  handy

 

Roger

[Pete Lewis]

why do you think you want a needle kit ???

one word of warning every time you mess with fuel hoses there is a good chance you slice of a sliver of rubber , these little sods float about and block the back of the float valve 

gives  a lack of fuel level and poor running, lots of tee shirts for this one 

fuel can go stale but ive never had  problem,  after months  not tried years .   

stick to the basics and one job at a time or it gets frustrating 

Pete

 

[poppyman]

When petrol goes off it smells like turps, but should still run but will smoke and pink.....

Tony.

[Roger89]

Like the bushes on the rear some didn't really need changing but I just thought that changing everything give us a clean slate. Plus definitely had the needle on the float chamber stick at least once or twice so far. Some of the parts if they looked good I labeled and kept for spares. Brake cylinder's etc.

Fuel hose look quite new but it's pretty cheap even braided esp if you buy a big roll.

Same with the ignition system. Other thing is that as the project is to teach my 15 year old son who's 1st car it's going to be at 17 then I got to show him how it all works and gets put together anyway.

I had him striping and rebuilding the rear drums shoes and slave cylinders dozens of times untill he can now fit them out blindfolded.

 

Would like to go electronic on the ignition but then he don't learn how to set points Etc.

Thanks for all the tips. I'll let you know how I get on here.

Pic below of him driving it on private car park.

He's already got his leather flying jacket on. Wants to be an engineer in the RAF so Spitfires certainly the right car for him.

Going to remove the fuel tank and paint it anyway so I'll get a good look at it then. Quite fancy replacing it with that new one knocking about. Just can't find any reviews on it.

I still remember clearly an awful incident when my own spit in the 80's suddenly decided to spring a bad leak. Never really be happy with having a fuel tank so close to the occupants of a car.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F143412999566

Thanks again for all your help guys.

[dougbgt6]

29 minutes ago, Roger89 said:

Fuel hose look quite new but it's pretty cheap even braided esp if you buy a big roll.

I would advise at least R9 rated or better still Gates Barricade from the club shop. These are not cheap, but are ethanol resistant. We don’t like ethanol! 😡

Doug

[Pete Lewis]

braided  .... you cant see when its failing     looks nice thats about all  if youre worried ....dont cover it up !!

dont buy alleged R9 from the  silly market   stick to branded from a know supplier   as Doug suggests club shop etc.

Pete

 

[Paul H]

I purchased R9 from a reputable seller on Ebay - It was fake and the inner bore started to melt and slivers continually blocked the float valve on the carbs . It took months to work out the issue - I now have Gates Barricade from the the shop, and no issues since then . The irony is R6 grade was on initially with no issues so "upgraded" to R9  thinking this would be a good step .I know several buyers took issue with the Ebay seller and their answer was there were different grades of R9 and you get what you pay for !!!!!

 

Paul 

[Mjit]

23 hours ago, Roger89 said:

Would only run with choke full on even after it warmed up.

While the mixture COULD be that far out, so worth checking (wind just up will flush with the carb throat, then back down (from memory) 2 turns to get a starting point) but I'd say unlikely so check/replace the hoses that go from each carb -> T piece -> rocker cover too.  I've had one of these split - the car would drive fine till I gave it some beans, at which point it would only run with the choke out.  The split would normally sit closed and all was well, but a bit of aggression would vibrate it open, letting loads of extra air in after the carbs and weakening the mixture to hell.

[Pete Lewis]

bad running and the learning curve.

  do have a look at the air filter make sure the ports in the filter are aligned, not upside down with the ports and breather holes in the carb front face 

Pete

[rlubikey]

That SC Parts Ebay ally tank - the first picture shows a press moulded tank (probably steel) but you have to go to the subsequent images to see the one they're selling. The aluminium is seam welded all round. Was your point Roger89 to ask, would you trust it with being so close to the driver after your disconcerting incident? Not sure I would either!

Cheers, Richard