Rockape Posted June 2, 2022 Report Share Posted June 2, 2022 Time to put new oil in the engine and gearbox of the Spitfire (Mk3, 1300…..4 speed box..no overdrive or syncromesh on 1st) what oil should I be using? thanks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josef Posted June 2, 2022 Report Share Posted June 2, 2022 20W50 for the engine. GL4 spec for the gearbox. I’ve been buying the Penrite stuff from the club shop recently for the engine, Castrol Syntrans in the gearbox since it came recommended from an overdrive specialist. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockape Posted June 12, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 Is there a classic car GL4 oil. ? Or are they all much of a muchness…..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 GL4 diff and gearbox oil is readily available, although I saw one recently that was labelled GL4 / 5 and I was wondering: how can it be both? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avivalasvegas Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 Highly recommend Redline MT-90 for the transmission. The improvement in shift quality and smoothness, over new, run-of-the-mill GL4 fluid, was noticeable. For motor oil, I will be filling up Liqui Moly MOS2 20W50 (given the believed superiority of MOS2 over ZDDP), and a German oil filter, at the next oil change given the improvements in idle noise and low speed acceleration I have experienced with my other Classics. If you're still in the ZDDP camp, Valvoline VR1 20W50 is hard to beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 any brand ep80/90 GL4 oil is ok putting classic in the label doesnt mean much there are GL5 that are compatible with brass /bronze non ferrous parts but you have to read the small print even halfords sell ep90 GL4 brand is not overly important most just bottle the stuff Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 These days almost all GL5 is ok with yellow metals, but always worth checking. However, GL5 is too slippery for a gearbox, and can stop the synchro rings biting properly. Even far more recent gearboxes use GL4 for gearboxes, and specifically warn against GL5. So for "us" the answer is use GL4 in both gearbox and diff unless you have very specific requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daverclasper Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 3 hours ago, clive said: Even far more recent gearboxes use GL5 Should that be GL4? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 19 minutes ago, daverclasper said: Should that be GL4? Yes, in context it was fairly obviously a typo. Some modern gearboxes use GL4, most use engine oil. The slant-cut teeth don't strictly need EP additives and the synchromesh definitely doesn't want any friction-reducers, but the additives in GL4 EP oils do help reduce wear on heavily stressed gears, for cars where the engine power is higher than the gearbox was designed for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daverclasper Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 Sorry, I didn't notice the last sentence, that sums it up anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 1 hour ago, NonMember said: Yes, in context it was fairly obviously a typo. Some modern gearboxes use GL4, most use engine oil. The slant-cut teeth don't strictly need EP additives and the synchromesh definitely doesn't want any friction-reducers, but the additives in GL4 EP oils do help reduce wear on heavily stressed gears, for cars where the engine power is higher than the gearbox was designed for. I haven't topped up a modern gearbox since the mid-1990s, and that was only because I carried out a five speed conversion on a four speed model. I've no idea at all what's used these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Truman Posted June 12, 2022 Report Share Posted June 12, 2022 being nationalistic for the gearbox and diff I use made in Aus Penrite Manual Gear 80 Oil which is a 80/85 GL4, somewhere in the speel it referred to being yellow metal compatible. Locally here the Penrite owners are opening a small museum of their historic cars for classic car clubs to visit, must arrange a visit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 13, 2022 Report Share Posted June 13, 2022 14 hours ago, daverclasper said: Should that be GL4? Yes. Now corrected. Apparently many engine oils meet GL4 spec, though no idea how you can check easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 13, 2022 Report Share Posted June 13, 2022 ive said before back in the late 80s the name over the door changed and we had to buy their oils , all our diffs up to 12ton had a lot of yellow thrust washers ther new supply was GL5 this in arduous conditions ate the thrusts and on warranty we had crates of failed diffs to research the culprit was obviously degraded metal , then we found the oil spec was incompatible but it cost a fortune especially on salt/snow plough where a good deal of wheel spin is evident and the thrusts wear minced on the diff /plannet gears Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piglet Posted June 13, 2022 Report Share Posted June 13, 2022 20/50w seems to be the general consensus. Is semi synthetic okay to use? Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 14, 2022 Report Share Posted June 14, 2022 9 hours ago, Piglet said: 20/50w seems to be the general consensus. Is semi synthetic okay to use? Alex It depends.... 20/50 is the original "correct grade" (aling with all sorts of alternatives if you look at the original handbook) and will work fine in a Triumph. If you want the durability of a semi synthetic, there are very few available. Off the top of my head, Millers CSS 20/50, or even 20/60 are about the only choices. Motul may do one? About £35 a can from Opie, but usually a 10% discount can be had. Most people tend to use a mineral 20-50, some though fear a semi or fully synthetic will cause damage (it won't) or because it is fine for most peoples usage. And usage is the key. If an engine is driven hard (eg on track, or thrashed on the road) the oil temp rises VERY quickly to temps that moneral oils won't like. But even an 80mph jaunt on a motorway will be fine with a mineral oil, just change it every 3K miles or annually. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piglet Posted June 14, 2022 Report Share Posted June 14, 2022 Thanks for the info Clive. I can't see why semi wouldn't work but I'll have a look and see what's available. Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteH Posted June 15, 2022 Report Share Posted June 15, 2022 I think I am in Pete`s camp here. A modern equivalent of what Triumph specified back in the day. Should cause no issues, and the cost of changing on a time, rather than mileage basis, even at 2022 prices cannot be that great?. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanMi Posted June 15, 2022 Report Share Posted June 15, 2022 On 14/06/2022 at 06:52, clive said: It depends.... 20/50 is the original "correct grade" (aling with all sorts of alternatives if you look at the original handbook) and will work fine in a Triumph. If you want the durability of a semi synthetic, there are very few available. Off the top of my head, Millers CSS 20/50, or even 20/60 are about the only choices. Motul may do one? About £35 a can from Opie, but usually a 10% discount can be had. Most people tend to use a mineral 20-50, some though fear a semi or fully synthetic will cause damage (it won't) or because it is fine for most peoples usage. And usage is the key. If an engine is driven hard (eg on track, or thrashed on the road) the oil temp rises VERY quickly to temps that moneral oils won't like. But even an 80mph jaunt on a motorway will be fine with a mineral oil, just change it every 3K miles or annually. actuall the original correct grade was not just 20/50 but a range as shown in the page from the 66 spitfire owners manual, 20w50 multigrade was probably not even available when the first version of our engines were built. It was the later recommendation so is what I would use today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 15, 2022 Report Share Posted June 15, 2022 7 minutes ago, DanMi said: actuall the original correct grade was not just 20/50 but a range as shown in the page from the 66 spitfire owners manual, 20w50 multigrade was probably not even available when the first version of our engines were built. It was the later recommendation so is what I would use today. That is what I was alluding to. Suggest on a Triumph forum that people should use a 10/30 and people would call you nuts, and yet it is in the book. Of course, the modern equivelent would be 5/30, and that would have the same viscosity when hot as the 10/30 as oils have improved don't change viscosity as much with temperature as older style oils. No reason not to use a more modern oil, though for most people it just isn't necessary. For me, it is essential as my engines have a hard time. My friend has done over 250K in his herald, all on straight 30 oil (out of the tap at work, apparently). And over 100K in his spitfire. The herald is getting a little smokey now, and has a little start up rattle. That engine was refreshed when he built it, just a hone and rings, new bearings etc. Not bad at all... but he does not drive his cars hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
68vitesse Posted June 15, 2022 Report Share Posted June 15, 2022 Was placing an order with James Paddock, for my Vitesse, so ordered a couple of 5L Dynolite 20/60 at £27.00 each. Very well packed and very reasonable delivery cost, I do about 2,500 miles in the Vitesse each year so two years of oil changes unless I cock something up like my water in oil earlier this year. Regards Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piglet Posted June 15, 2022 Report Share Posted June 15, 2022 Just had a trawl through eBay and all the oil is mineral, and at wildly varying prices, sometimes for the exact same stuff. One thing that made me chuckle was so called Harley Davidson oil at £45. As if they make it... Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteH Posted June 16, 2022 Report Share Posted June 16, 2022 Haynes, who always seem to recomend "Castrol", in their 1982, print of the Manual. where recomending 20w/50, by that time., "Castrolite" was also spec; in the First edition 1200. Handbook. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted June 16, 2022 Report Share Posted June 16, 2022 To understand more about lubricants, I recommend the small book "Which Oil?" by Richard Michell. He is a retired oil industry guy, who got into classics on his retirement, and found so much was misunderstood and based on myth in that world that he wrote his book. No connection with Michell, save as a reader, John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffds1360 Posted June 16, 2022 Report Share Posted June 16, 2022 What about this stuff? Only about £17 a gallon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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