MJH2454 Posted June 5, 2020 Report Share Posted June 5, 2020 Another numpty question, the callipers and discs have seen better days, is it worth upgrading to drilled and vented discs, i.e. improved braking performance or does this only apply in wet conditions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkshire_spam Posted June 5, 2020 Report Share Posted June 5, 2020 I don't think there's a simple route to vented discs on a Spitfire? I think drilled discs are more of a gimmick than a real benefit. Standard (decent quality) discs, well serviced calipers and some good pads (Mintex m1144 compound) - plenty of braking power for a car as light as a Spitfire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted June 5, 2020 Report Share Posted June 5, 2020 Drilled, no. Pointless, and stresses the disc , so that it will crack Vented, yes, but only if you are pass-storming or in competition. Wet conditions apply far more to traction of tyre on road than pads on disc, except in monsoon conditions. Brakes are are warm and dry off, tyres don't! Good tyres, not chinese knock-offs more than five years old, can make all the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougbgt6 Posted June 5, 2020 Report Share Posted June 5, 2020 I tried dimpled and grooved, no noticeable difference to everyday driving and nobody tells you they are NOISEY. I moved them on and reverted to standard and Mintex pads. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 5, 2020 Report Share Posted June 5, 2020 think OP may mean grooved and/or drilled discs. Think they may have a slight benefit with some brake pad compounds, helping with degassing or suchlke? But on our cars, there will be a great improvement by fitting a new, normal disc. (here's the issue, people replace old discs with new grooved etc disc, thinking the bling bit is doing the job, when in fact it is the fact the disc is new!) And then fit mintex 1144 pad material. You will then have excellent brakes as long as the calipers/brake hoses etc are all good and the rears are correctly set up. And yes, I did have a car with new grooved/drilled discs. And 4 pot calipers. Changed to normal but vented discs with std spaced calipers. No loss in normal braking, but far better fade resistance when, as John points out, going down Stelvio or on a trackday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Clark Posted June 5, 2020 Report Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, dougbgt6 said: I tried dimpled and grooved, no noticeable difference to everyday driving and nobody tells you they are NOISEY. I moved them on and reverted to standard and Mintex pads. Doug +1 I've had exactly the same experience as Doug, plus the discs and pads wore rapidly. Like him, I now run standard discs and calipers with Mintex 1144 pads. This gives sufficient stopping power for my 2.5 litre GT6 under road conditions. I would only want a further brake upgrade if I was going to indulge in track days. Nigel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJH2454 Posted June 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2020 I'm changing the callipers on my Spitfire should I bleed the whole system once complete or just the front? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Twitchen Posted June 6, 2020 Report Share Posted June 6, 2020 It makes eminent sense to bleed the whole system then you know for sure there is fresh fluid there and ticks the box before needing to change it as part of the service schedule. Dick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johny Posted June 6, 2020 Report Share Posted June 6, 2020 On 05/06/2020 at 11:54, dougbgt6 said: I tried dimpled and grooved, no noticeable difference to everyday driving and nobody tells you they are NOISEY. I moved them on and reverted to standard and Mintex pads. Doug I thought the theory was they help remove the gases released from the pads under very heavy braking so won't make any difference for normal road driving... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Clark Posted June 6, 2020 Report Share Posted June 6, 2020 The crashed Mk1 Spitfire I bought in January to rebuild has drilled and grooved discs............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 6, 2020 Report Share Posted June 6, 2020 4 hours ago, Neil Clark said: The crashed Mk1 Spitfire I bought in January to rebuild has drilled and grooved discs............. I'll not ask how it crashed.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted June 6, 2020 Report Share Posted June 6, 2020 Failed to stop in time possibly.......? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Lewis Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 in spoil sport mode they are another Must Have you Dont need expensive and useless if you stick to basics a the design is tried and tested by triumph leave bling and must haves to the parts you dont need to give you grief Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 I agree with Pete (10th Dan) Lewis. The only 'bling' in my 13/60 is the remote control for the electric gates. 🤭 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 23 hours ago, johny said: I thought the theory was they help remove the gases released from the pads under very heavy braking so won't make any difference for normal road driving... Gases? What gases? The point of 'bedding in' pads is not to conform them to the worn discs - they will do that anyway - but to heat them to the highest temp they will meet in use. This will drive off any remaining volatiles from manufacture. If air is being drawn under the pads, then they or the discs are too badly worn for use! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 Lots of non-standard parts on my car.But virtually zero I would regard as bling. I guess the wind deflector fitted to the roll-bar could be called bling, and the stickers on it are (but all from places I have been with the car) The roll-bar is certainly not bling. I think just about everything else is purely functional. Hmm, it does have a power amp and speakers, guess that could go..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, JohnD said: Gases? What gases? The point of 'bedding in' pads is not to conform them to the worn discs - they will do that anyway - but to heat them to the highest temp they will meet in use. This will drive off any remaining volatiles from manufacture. If air is being drawn under the pads, then they or the discs are too badly worn for use! I believe older tech pads may have produced gasses when hot, and a bit of digging suggests this is not a problem with modern (read last few decades) friction material. Also helps with wet conditions, and very (very very) slightly with disc cooling. https://blog.racetechnologies.com/2015/04/09/the-advantages-of-cross-drilled-and-slotted-discs/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave.vitesse Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 If your car is a standard Spitfire then the standard brakes should work well. It's a light car and the standard front 9" disc are effective. The Heralds if a standard car also are adequate for road use. GT6 and Vitesse brakes work well for road use but need just a bit more push on the brake pedal as they are larger overall. TR2-6 on standard cars are adequate for road used. TR7 and maybe Dolomite Sprint brakes can be a worry. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 Thanks, Clive, interesting link! They claim that the drillings increase surface area and so cooling. Hmmmmmm! Yes, slightly, but at the same time they will REDUCE the frictional area! Changing the size of a brake pad has no effect on braking (within reason changes) as friction depends on intersurface pressure. not area. A smaller pad will be squeezed harder against the disc, per unit area. But a hole in the disc will not affect the pressure, while making the area smaller, so less friction! And then they mention the cracking that develops around drillings in rotors, and that while this does happen, the drilling in their discs aren't just drillings, they're BREMBO drillings! "With a complicated shape". Again, Hmmmmm! Some race teams will use drilled disks as they believe in the pad cleaning effect. But they will diligently "life" the disks, replacing them before they crack and inspect them regularly in case of premature cracking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain T Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 Special Brembo hole conditions I can understand as even a radius around the hole edge will relieve stress. I am sure Brembo have done extensive tests so there is no reason to not believe their claim. The real question is, is this required to stop safely in a shorter distance than solid rotors in our relatively lightweight Triumphs? It really depends on how you drive your car. I think someone said a decent set of boots will be more effective than drilled discs and I think that's correct. Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Clark Posted June 7, 2020 Report Share Posted June 7, 2020 18 hours ago, Colin Lindsay said: I'll not ask how it crashed.... I've not been able to find out, but rebuilt 1147cc (Yeah man) plus Weber 40DCOE with weird home made linkage that stuck to the exhaust manifold (now replaced) plus drilled and grooved discs plus racing pads (that will be replaced) may have had something to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thescrapman Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 18 hours ago, dave.vitesse said: TR7 and maybe Dolomite Sprint brakes can be a worry. Dave Sprint is not a maybe! They are adequate when in top condition. They do have bigger rear drums, but also a valve to limit pressure as they are so mis-matched to the small front brakes they lock up. I drove a sprint with "poor" brakes. I then declined to drive it again despite the owner saying they were fine. He was pursuaded to buy a conversion from Jon Jackson as he needed his 2 co- drivers on board. Then he conceded he was wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 26 minutes ago, thescrapman said: Sprint is not a maybe! They are adequate when in top condition. They do have bigger rear drums, but also a valve to limit pressure as they are so mis-matched to the small front brakes they lock up. I drove a sprint with "poor" brakes. I then declined to drive it again despite the owner saying they were fine. He was pursuaded to buy a conversion from Jon Jackson as he needed his 2 co- drivers on board. Then he conceded he was wrong. Those same brakes on all the other Dolomites are a worry. Last year at Spa I had to take the Toledo, and avoided serious brake fade by the obvious solution of not using them. Led to some entertaining corners at speed, a lot of body roll and overtook allsorts in the bends including a Honda S2000 (who was extremely non-plussed, and bravely left us for dust on the straight) And yes, I have a "trackerjack-ish" conversion to carry out. Though the plan may change to even larger discs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonMember Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 The Dolomite front brakes are OK... by comparison to the TR7 ones! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Lindsay Posted June 8, 2020 Report Share Posted June 8, 2020 On 06/06/2020 at 13:08, johny said: I thought the theory was they help remove the gases released from the pads under very heavy braking so won't make any difference for normal road driving... Fluids maybe; I remember them being advertised (through the Club Shop? must check later...) as removing rainwater from the disc surface more quickly therefore preventing poor braking due to water on the disc. If you want bling on your brakes... try the other end? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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